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[325]The luck of the heros

Discussion in 'Konoha Library Archives' started by McNaruto, Oct 2, 2006.

  1. McNaruto Friendly

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    More of our favorite heros stay alive, or win more because of luck then skill. Here are my examples:

    1) Deidara choses to lure Naruto and subsequently Kakashi out into the forest setting up both one against two fights which give the heros the greatest chance of winning.

    2) Haku decided to prolong the fight with Sasuke and Naruto instead of just killing them off. He avoided aiming for vital spots.

    3) Hidan chooses to take them on one against four. If they both attacked, Shikamaru would not have had the time, he needed to analyze Hidan's attack. How many battles do you get where you get to sit and think about it in the middle of the fight. Where one enemy just stands around and watches. Up till now they fought all of their battles together even two on one. But now all of sudden they take them one of four, horray for luck.

    4) Same thing goes for Oro's four who escorted Sasuke, they defeated Junnin together, but fought one on one and were defeated.

    Of course there are many more examples. If say Tsunade fought someone who uses poison she would be done for. She believes in the "Throw my body in the way" Jutsu and like Sakura would subcomb to the poisin and be enable to control their chakra and subsequently be unable to heal herself.

    So horray for LUCK in all its forms it keeps the story going.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2006
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  2. Sai_What Custome title? How troublesome

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    Its not luck...its plot no jutsu.
    But the Haku one doesn't count...he wasn't TRYING to kill them, he doesn't kill people.
     
  3. Orga777 I LIVE... FOR THE FOURTH TIME!

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    And the Sound Four needed to hurry up and get Sasuke to Orochimaru. So they didn't have the time to fight properly. Which is why it was left for one on one matches.
     
  4. McNaruto Friendly

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    That's lucky to fight against someone who does not like to kill. However Haku had viewed them as enemy combatants, and thus had no problem toturing them. Since they were not citizens of the country and they are on the battlefield.
     
  5. McNaruto Friendly

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    Why isn't that kind of LUCKY :)
     
  6. Orga777 I LIVE... FOR THE FOURTH TIME!

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    I guess so.:laugh
     
  7. Woozie Active Member

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    And Kimimaro was seriously sick up to the point he was coughing up blood during the fight.
     
  8. McNaruto Friendly

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    It was lucky for Gara and Lee that he died before he did his suprise attack. And luck for Konoha because with his strength Oro would have been unstoppable. He was slated to be Oro's next body after all.
     
  9. Uzumaki~Kakashi Tomoyo's #1

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    Lucky! Naruto should do the Lucky Dance. Lucky, Lucky, luckY!!! luCKKY.

    Sasuke not killing Naruto. LUCKY!
     
  10. Sai_What Custome title? How troublesome

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    ^ lots of it is luck, but thats not. Sasuke didn't want to / couldn't kill Naruto. (Depending on how you interpret it...either he didn't want to kill Naruto to prove his brother wrong or he just didn't have the heart)
     
  11. Woozie Active Member

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    ^ Though he had his hand through Naruto's chest already earlier that fight.
     
  12. Uzumaki~Kakashi Tomoyo's #1

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    He spared him on a whim.... Naruto very lucky Sasuke changed his mind. Naruto winning all those chance games he exudes luckyness:)
     
  13. Ofkinheimer Active Member

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    How exactly was the killing of Hidan "luck"? Fights are all about opportunities presented by the opponent and absent the other characters effectively defending against those opportunities, we really have no room to claim that was luck rather than their lack of skill or lack of judgement that caused them to lose. Hidan did not strategize or judge his opponents which, for me, speaks much about his lack of skillset.

    Did Hidan see that he was against 4 people? Yes
    Did Hidan eagerly state, given his skillset, that he'll kill everyone of them? Yes
    Did Hidan give the opponent an opportunity? Yes
    Did Hidan underestimate his opponents? Yes


    Seems more like a lack of battle skillset when he gave the opponents an opportunity (i.e. Not quickly eliminating one of the opponents) to defeat him. (Regardless of if it was by Shikamaru or anyone else).

    It has nothing to do with whose jutsu is stronger. Strong shinobi doesn't automatically win a battle (especially when the strong shinobi isn't intelligent enough to finish his opponents quickly, rather than sit there talking).

    So no, it wasn't luck. It was Hidan's stupidity which caused him to lose. Stupidity from a lack of skillset that could have been employed by immediately finishing off the first opponent before taking on the rest.

    So, short of us jumping into heavy speculation of "this would have happened because of that" or "that would have happen because of this" we simply have to accept the plot as presented for plot reasons.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2006
  14. elektroniks formerly mookville90

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    Deidara bombs aren't gonna work in a secluded cave. He would've had a great chance of injuring Sasori which would create a handicap to him.

    That's just part of haku's character and I cassify that as fate.

    Hidan is very hot-headed and prideful in my view of him, and doesn't want to accept help from someone if he thinks he caan win. And he underestimated the opponents which is his error so it's his fault his head is chopped off. But he can still fight cuz he's a zombie.

    They didn't have a choice, they had to hurry his body to Oro.

    It depends on the level of the poison user, and she probably has potions for poisons with her since she's a medic ninja.
     
  15. elektroniks formerly mookville90

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    But at the end he could barely stand i doubt he had enough strength. And it may just be me but I think Naruto had a chance to win but didn't seize the oppurtunity. I'm talking about when they were clashing and how Naruto went for the head thing, while Sasuke goes for the vital spot. So that's kinda plot no jutsu there.
     
  16. Enterprise E Member

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    I chalk up Naruto scratching Sasuke's headband instead of clawing his eyes out, slashing his throat, or tearing Sasuke's face open as a sign of Naruto not having the heart to kill his best friend. There, Sasuke was the lucky one. And after Naruto was knocked unconscious, he was lucky that Sasuke decided to "return" his kindness. I wonder if Sasuke realized that Naruto could have killed him, but held back at the last moment and that could have been why Sasuke realized that Naruto was not just some measuring stick, but someone who cared about him.
     
  17. McNaruto Friendly

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    A lot of you have made good rebutal points especially Ofkinheimer and Mookville90, and I find myself with no great replies.
     
  18. Ofkinheimer Active Member

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    My thoughts exactly. Given his nature, Naruto never intended to kill Sasake, so regardless of how the fight ended or who hit who first/last, a logical conclusion suggests that all of his heavy attacks would have been curtailed just enough to not inflict death on Sasake. Sasake, on the other hand, had already proven that he had full murder intent..........and had already killed Naruto (Naruto only survived because of Kyuubi - which Sasake didn't know existed in Naruto, or knew that it could heal him)

    Naruto trying to incapacitate Sasake? Yes, but never killed him. Which leads me to believe that at the very end Naruto likely reduced the power of his rasengan/or disintergrated it. Meaning that he wouldn't have aimed a Rasengan at Sasake head (knowing what will happen if it contacted direct on the head) and so any intentional aim for the head was a concentrated and symbolic effort to acknowledge their rivalry/friendship/Sasake's past challenge, i.e. scatching Sasake's forehead protector.

    And yes, the scratch was very intentional.
     
  19. Odlam Team 7 4 Life

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    Both Naruto and Sasuke held back at VOTE - Sasuke rapped his knuckle on Naruto's chest instead of impaling him, and Naruto only scratched Sasuke's forehead instead of hitting him in the face with the chakra claws

    Did everybody completely miss the point of the fade to white with little Naruto and Sasuke holding hands? It was symbolism that Naruto and Sasuke had ended the fight with thier bond still intact, and they both held back at the last possible second.

    Can't believe Kishi slaps the readers in the face with something like that so blatantly showing them making a mutual sign of friendship, and people still think either one of them were trying to kill the other at that last second. Naruto had gotten through to Sasuke by that point, he had abandoned the Mangekyo Sharingan concept because it came at too high a price.

    As far as the heroes surviving by luck, that's just the plot. Deal with it. I can't think of a single series where the heroes shouldn't be dead 20,000 times over. Actually, Naruto does a much better job then most really, at least they don't lose 50,000 gallons of blood and somehow not die or simply shrug off insanely serious injuries with the power of thier convictions.
     
  20. dregoth Cooking Genius

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    Read the manga. It was Sasuke who spared Naruto when they clashed and the scratch was made off panel, so nothing can be assumed about him holding back or not.

    His left arm was already screwed and Naruto had lost most of his momentum in the Chidori/Rasengan clash, so he couldn't do any more damage to Sasuke.

    Naruto got lucky 4 times in that fight.

    1)Kyuubi regenerating Chidori,
    2)Going Kyuubi level 1 to foil Sharingan,
    3)Sasuke clenching his claws into a fist in the final clash,
    4)Sasuke sparing his life for the 2nd time.

    Sasuke was only lucky to have awakened the 3 tomoe on a crucial moment.

    Anyway, Kishi is being coherent with the luck stuff that he used in databook I.

    Naruto's luck (4) have always been a factor since chapter 1 and his learning of jutsus, rasengan being the #1 in the list.

    Sasuke's miserable luck (2) manifested since they've fought Haku, then Oro in the forest of Death, then the Yoroi in the prelims (a bad matchup given the CS), etc...
     
  21. Kanii AHH! OOHH! :D

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    ... and will of fire. :(

    Anyway, almost every shonen is like that and it's fine. That so called "luck" just makes the story more interesting, no-one wants to see the main character dying at chapter 20 or something like that. :omg
     
  22. Ofkinheimer Active Member

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    Here is the whole "luck" thing again. I might as well add. Sasake was lucky Naruto didn't go KN2 - 4 on him.

    Reaching much? Yeah, but it fits.
     
  23. Al?l? Sweet dreams

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    Rock Lee: "... luck is a part of real strength..."
     
  24. nefer_sbedjieb Hope's Jinchuuriki

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    luck it a vital point for a ninja.
    without it, they would end up all dead
     
  25. Leanne Active Member

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    Naruto only scratched his forhead in the final clash, because Sasuke said he couldn't even do that. In their first fight remember. :wtf
    That was touching if you think about it, he could've hit him somewhere else where it would bring more damage.

    I know that isn't really the point here, but just felt like saying it.
    Everybody needs luck. If you look at a soccer game.. how many times they almost miss and things ike that. Or just simple stuff in eveyrday live. Luck luck luck. Just try to accept it in the manga too. Bad guys will loose. :amuse
     
  26. The Pink Ninja Infamous Cocksucker

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    FOR THE LOVE OF GRANDAD'S MOONSHNE!

    Being lucky, Godtouched or just plain destined is the almost the definition of a hero. It's what Heroes do.
     
  27. Shinnou Genkaku It must be true if I say it

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    I understand ur point but theres a fine line between luck, and pure plot no jutsu assisted bullshit. I'll let u guess which side of the fence Naruto falls on
     
  28. Gai-Sifu The Wild Green Beast of Raabu

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    Looks like luck wasn't enough to save asuma...

    or the third for that matter...
     
  29. Twicks Needs a Tuba

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    I think the biggest 'luck' moment is Naruto running into Jaraiya in that random hot spring town. What are the chances that Naruto would just bump into just the guy he needed at that moment?

    I can't think of any explanation other than pure coincidence.
     
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