1. Welcome to the forums! Take a second to look at our Beginner's Guide. It contains the information necessary for you to have an easier experience here.

    Thanks and have fun. -NF staff
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Dismiss Notice

  3. Voting is open in the KCC Haiku Contest!
    Entries can be found here.
    The poll closes on August 24th at 2:59pm UTC.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. img
    Dragon Ball Drawing Contest: Black & White Edition.
    Deadline is on August 30th at 11pm UTC
    Dismiss Notice
  5. img
    Come enter in the KCC Cooking Contest 6!
    Deadline for entries: September 08th at 1600 EST.
    Dismiss Notice

A true plot hole (about time).

Discussion in 'Konoha Library Archives' started by Futagokage, Oct 25, 2006.

  1. Futagokage

    Messages:
    1,329
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Reputation:
    Did you see Excel Saga? Do you remamber Pedro screaming: "That means Gomez was with my wife before I died", well, something like that happen.

    This is all about Itachi, yes, That boy who at age of 13 was ANBU squad leader, my probles is with this page:



    This means that someone is lying us:notrust , because:

    - If Itachi is 18 years old at the end of part I, he enter the Akatsuki after Orochimaru left the group.

    -If Itachi was 13 years when he killed his clan, and Orochimaru left just a few months after Itachi joinage, then Itachi is not 18 (he should be 20)

    -Other possibility is that Itachi killed his clan at the age of 10, which is absurd because a 10 years old child cannot be ANBU squad leader at 13.

    - Other option is that Itachi were in the Akatsuki some years before killing his clan.

    Opinions, The 18 years is supposed or Official, I made this thread to hear opinions.
     
    Tags:
  2. Gyroscope

    Messages:
    5,243
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2005
    Reputation:
    General feeling is that Itachi had joined Akatsuki before he murdered his clan. Probably sometime when the super secret mission was handed out to him. It was also then that he obtained the MS.
    Most probably a little after he joined, Oro left cos he had been surpassed by a child.
    He kills his clan a couple of years later.

    Why not? There is no restriction stating when one can join ANBU (other that what is in your head). Kakashi was chuunin at 6.
     
  3. DeepThought

    Messages:
    7,006
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2006
    Reputation:
  4. DeepThought

    Messages:
    7,006
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2006
    Reputation:
    Sorry for doubling
    [Nipponsei]Code Geass Hangyaku no Lelouch ED Single - Yuukyou Seishunka-ALI PROJECT

    Itachi Timeline:

    BSS: Before Series Start
    ASS: After Series Start
    (All dates approximate)

    17 Yrs. BSS - Uchiha Itachi born.
    10 Yrs. BSS - Graduates Academy, becomes Genin.
    9 Yrs. BSS - Activates Sharingan for the first time.
    7 Yrs. BSS - Passes Chuunin Exam.
    5-4 Yrs. BSS - Becomes captain of ANBU. Begins to become disenfranchised with his clan. Accused of murdering Uchiha Shisui. Gains Mangekyou Sharingan.
    4-3 Yrs. BSS - Wipes out clan, leaving only Uchiha Sasuke behind. Joins Akatsuki Organization.
    0 - Series Start
    7 Mo. ASS - Comes to Konoha with Hoshigaki Kisame to capture Naruto.
    3 Yrs. 3 Mo. ASS - Engages in delay action with Kisame against Konoha and Suna ninja to allow Akatsuki to remove Shukaku from Gaara.

    Orochimaru:
    Orochimaru would eventually leave the group after several years. It was during this period when Uchiha Itachi joined. It is not entirely clear if Orochimaru left Organization purely because of his feelings toward Itachi or some other disagreement with the group.

    It's all very vague. The end.
     
  5. Spanish Hoffkage

    Messages:
    16,505
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2006
    Reputation:
    Itachi won the MS killing Sishui at 11. Oro left.

    He get Anbu leader and Uchiha pwnge at 13.

    edit: Or what leafninja says in DT post :oh
     
  6. Futagokage

    Messages:
    1,329
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Reputation:
    Well, i say it because if he kill his clan ehen he was 10 years old, then he would left the clan that year, so he could never became an ANBU member at 13 because he would not be in the village :sweatdrop ... (My mistake I did not explained well).

    Thanks for answering!
     
  7. Alekzu

    Messages:
    519
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2006
    Reputation:
    I have no problems with this opinion. It's what I've asumed all along. The other opinions cannot be verified with the manga. But, since the manga never mentions when Itachi joined the Akatsuki this option is valid. Itachi got the MS when he was 11, so my personal opinion is that he was allowed to join the Akatsuki after or just before that (it was stated in the manga that his behaviour had gone strange after he joined the ANBU).

    This may all sound a little fuzzy, so I'm hoping someone elese will explain it even more. :amuse

    Edit: Someone already did
     
  8. Seelas

    Messages:
    1,115
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2006
    Reputation:
    I think you might be onto something, Futagokage.
    That can't be true, because if the last time they gathered was seven years ago, when Orochimaru left the organization, then that means....well duh, Orochimaru left the organization seven years ago. And we already know that he left because of Itachi. So Itachi must have joined the Akatsuki at least seven years ago.

    So the only option is that Itachi was in Akatsuki ever since becoming a chuunin - meaning that he joined them before even obtaining the Mangekyou Sharingan - and was working for both the ANBU and Akatsuki simultaneously. This is somewhat plausible, but it doesn't make much sense to me that the Akatsuki would care about Itachi before he obtained the MS, or that they'd care about anyone who was only a chuunin for that matter. We assume that it's Itachi's Mangekyou Sharingan that caused Orochimaru to leave the Akatsuki seven years ago, but he didn't even have the MS seven years ago. Was Itachi really so far ahead of Orochimaru that he was significantly stronger than him even without the MS?

    It sounds to me like Kishimoto just fucked up his timeline.
     
  9. Grrblt

    Messages:
    24,215
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2005
    Reputation:
    He did work for Akatsuki and Anbu at the same time, and he also had the MS at that time. He got MS from killing Shisui, not from murdering his whole clan. He killed Shisui and entered Akastuki when he was 11, and murdered his clan when he war 13. There's no plot hole.
     
  10. Ofkinheimer

    Messages:
    2,176
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    May 4, 2006
    Reputation:
    Didn't Oro say he left Akatsuki because of Itachi? Meaning that there would have been a period when they were both in it at the same time which would imply that Itachi was in Akatsuki prior to murdering his clan.

    ETA: I won't be surprised if it is revealed that Oro was the one who recruited Itachi for Akatsuki and revealed to him the secrets of the Sharingan (given his medical research/jutsu knowledge)......with the intention of making him a container eventually.
     
  11. Futagokage

    Messages:
    1,329
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Reputation:
    I feel this a little complex, thanks for opinions but we need more, the we know that Itachi has to be in akatsuki at least since he was 11 years old, so he can be at the same time of Orochimaru and he was an member of akatsuki at least 2 years before killing his clan.
     
  12. Gyroscope

    Messages:
    5,243
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2005
    Reputation:
    Ah yes. Well like i said, he killed his clan shortly after becoming an ANBU, but obtained MS a coupl eof years before.
     
  13. geG

    Messages:
    26,575
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2006
    Reputation:
    Basically yeah, by the time Itachi was 11 he had joined Akatsuki (or at least had contact with them) and become so powerful that Orochimaru left. At 13, he killed off his clan and left for good.
     
  14. Woozie

    Messages:
    4,642
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2005
    Reputation:
    How do you guys know it was as much as 2-3 years in between Itachi gaining MS and killing the clan?

    I just read the Uchiha gaiden again and it felt like just a few days.
     
  15. Shisui

    Messages:
    2,366
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2004
    Reputation:
    Why does the fact that Oro left Akatsuki because of Itachi necessarily imply that Itachi was in Akatsuki before Oro left? If anything, I'd say Itachi probably wasn't an Akatsuki member until after he slaughtered the clan and after Oro had already defected.

    Consider the facts:

    - We know the Akatsuki have contacts with subordinates who are also prospective members (for example, Tobi). Itachi could easily have been in contact with Akatsuki indirectly through Oro for a long time without actually being a member.

    - We know the Akatsuki test their prospective members before they're admitted into the organization (Itachi says he slaughtered the clan to "test his capacity" or to "measure the capacity of his vessel," which fits with that)

    - We know the Akatsuki so far have all been missin nin who wear cloaks, rings, and scratched forehead protectors (before Itachi slaughtered the Uchiha he was still a Konoha nin and didn't wear a ring)

    - What we DON'T know is why, exactly, Orochimaru defected. We know it has something to do with not being able to take Itachi's body and/or Itachi being stronger, but that doesn't tell us anything about Itachi's role in Akatsuki at that point.
     
  16. LynnAzure

    Messages:
    946
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Joined:
    May 28, 2005
    Reputation:
    Maybe the Akatsuki of 7 years ago didn't have Itachi in it.

    Just read the post above, I agree.
     
  17. Shisui

    Messages:
    2,366
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2004
    Reputation:
    Makin' it a double!

    At the beginning of the gaiden Itachi has just joined the ANBU, "six months after becoming a chuunin" - according to Fugaku. Which makes him about 10 1/2.

    When the detectives come, they say it's been six months since he joined the ANBU, making Itachi about 11.

    When Itachi slaughtered the Uchiha he was at least 13, because Kakashi told us that he became an ANBU captain at 13.
     
  18. The Times

    Messages:
    934
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2006
    Reputation:
    Yeah, exactly...The Police came to the house asking him why he and Shisui didn't turn up for the Uchiha meeting the night before. Then they said that Shisui was drowned in the Nanako river the night before. Then about two days later, Sasuke asked Fugaku about the MS, then later on that day, Itachi killed everybody.

    It wasn't 2-3 years, it was 2 days.

    It would be pretty wierd for Sasuke to ask his dad about something that happened two years ago.
     
  19. cognitivedissonance

    Messages:
    3,445
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    316
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2006
    Reputation:
    a plot hole = why did shikamaru need to throw a suriken to "distract" that sound girl?
     
  20. Grrblt

    Messages:
    24,215
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2005
    Reputation:
    Well, disregard Gentz's proof above and just assume for a second that there is no proof how much time passed inbetween Shisui's death and the Uchiha slaughter.
    Your idea creates a plot hole.
    Our idea doesn't.
    Therefore, your situation is less likely. A lot less likely in fact.
     
  21. Reznor Administrator

    Messages:
    48,015
    Likes Received:
    2,236
    Trophy Points:
    2,533
    Joined:
    Dec 31, 1969






    Obviousy, Itachi killed the clan at 11. Then they promoted him to ANBU captain via some kind of paperwork error. :nuts

    So she wouldn't brace herself for hitting the wall.
     
  22. Descent of the Lion

    Messages:
    8,591
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    394
    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2006
    Reputation:
    I assume that Itachi has been in Akatsuki before he killed his clan. That would explain his odd behavior.
     
  23. The Times

    Messages:
    934
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2006
    Reputation:
    True,true...But it'd still be wierd for Sasuke to start thinking about something that happened two years ago on that day...

    And he probably was in Akatsuki before he kileld tem all. Maybe him doing that is what made Oro scared of him, and leave the group.
     
  24. Grrblt

    Messages:
    24,215
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2005
    Reputation:
    Kids occasionally think about something for a long time before asking. And I don't have the chapters available but is it confirmed that Sasuke asked about MS the same day as the mass murder?
     
  25. Sariachan

    Messages:
    3,177
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2004
    Reputation:
    Interesting thread, I never really cared about Itachi so my ideas about his timeline are a bit confused... *keeps reading*
     
  26. BowL

    Messages:
    1,001
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2006
    Reputation:
    I think that he was in Akatsuki before he killed his clan. Kinda like a gang, his killing his clan, has secured his spot in the Group. This killing of the entire Uchiha clan scared the piss outta Oro, and he turned tail.
     
  27. Divinstrosity

    Messages:
    13,874
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    493
    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2006
    Reputation:
    Remember when Itachi's father asked him what was he doing when he was 'lecturing the police? Itachi said he was carrying out his duty. What does that mean?

    His Akatsuki duty?
     
Loading...