1. AAB SEASON THREE

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About Indra and Asura transmigrancy.

Discussion in 'House of Uzumaki' started by saidA2000, Aug 12, 2018.

  1. saidA2000 New Member

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    This is a convo from somewhere about this, who is in the right and wrong, the blue text colour is me,green is random but relevant comments while black is the comments from the guy im primarily arguing with, its quite long so bear with me. Ill seperate each by paragraphs. Convo starts next paragraph.


    That is a common misconception, SO6P did not share his power with Naruto and Sasuke, in fact, he himself said that he couldn't even materialize himself into the living world, all SO6P did was activate SPSM for Naruto who already had a portion of the chakra of all Bijuu given to him by Obito and activated RinneSharingan for Sasuke who already had Hashirama's Chakra given to him and a near death situation like Madara did when he got the Rinnegan.
    Hagoromo at his peak as the Juubi Jinchuriki would probably stomp Naruto/Sasuke.

    Wow I haven't seen anyone talk abt hashi giving chakra to Sasuke before... That makes so much sense...

    The hashirama cells that kabuto gave to sasuke would’ve done nothing as the those were hashiramas cells when he wasn’t an ashura transmigrant, so there was no way the cells would’ve played a part in the formation of sasuke’s 6T rinnegan. Hagoromo was responsible for it.


    as those were Hashirama's cells when he wasn't an ashura transmigrant

    What do you mean by that? Hashirama was always an Ashura reincarnation and I'm not talking about hashi's cells btw,


    I don’t think you understood me clearly, to attain the rinnegan, you need to merge the chakra of Indra and Asura. Currently, Naruto and Sasuke are Asura and Indra’s reincarnates respectively. Therefore, hashirama giving sasuke his chakra doesn’t make a difference since his time of being an Asura incarnate ended long ago so his chakra does not have “that” Asura chakra anymore, naruto does, and hashirama gave sasuke his chakra in the 4th war which at that point in time naruto was the Asura incarnate, not hashirama, this the arguments claiming sasuke awakened the rinnegan because of hashirama cells or chakra is a moot point. However if naruto were to give sasuke his chakra then sasuke would awaken the rinnegan as he the current active Asura incarnate, however as that never happened, the only logical argument and fact is that sasuke awakened his unique rinnegan through hagoromo’s chakra(which is what is created when you add both Indra and Asura chakra together) Sasuke got the hagoromo chakra straight from the source instead of taking Asura chakra, which also probably sped up the rinnegan transformation process instead of madara, who bit off hasirama’s flesh when He WAS the Asura incarnate at that time, but because he only bit of a little bit, it took him a long time to produce hagoromo or sp chakra and therefore the rinnegan.

    When Hagaromo met the Edo Kages, he said it was possible by using Revived Madara's body which still had Indra along with other stuff. The Asura and Indra chakra are still part of their own even after death.


    Thats wrong, that why they’re called transmigrants, when and Indra or Asura incarnate dies, they cease to be an incarnate, thus alongside losing their transmigrant status, they lose the Indra/Asura chakra. In the war when so6p met naruto and sasuke, he said that Indra Asura chakra was clinging onto them. Onto your point, the reason why madara had both chakras is because he basically was the ttj which meant he had tb chakra and sp or hagoromo chakra,which is the result of a merger of Indra and Asura chakra anyways, that’s why in the scan you provided hagoromo was like “ I was basically able to emerge because madara had hagoromo chakra” which is both Indra and Asura chakra combined.

    Another reason could be because madara had broken the cycle and attempted to gain the rinnegan(which he did) which hagoromo had tried to warn against the Uchiha attempting to do so, therefore he was able to keep hagoromo’s chakra(which is again, a merger of Indra and Asura chakra) as his own, however because he died, he still kept the hagoromo chakra, but lost his transmigrant status, which was passed onto sasuke with sasuke now having Indra chakra. Meanwhile hashirama did none of that crazy stuff and died normally as expected, uninterrupting the natural flow of transmigrancy(At least in the Asura line of successors).

    Hagaromo would have outright say it was his chakra but said both his children's chakra was there. The reason Hagaromo mentioned those names because Madara mixed both chakra during his lifetime and still kept them.

    Those chakras are still part of them and Madara is proof of that.

    Did you read what I said bro, I agreed that madara still had hagoromo’s chakra and thus both of his children’s chakra in him because of madara obtaining the rinnegan, but he isn’t a transmigrant anymore and therefore time has moved on with sasuke now indras reincarnate and has indras chakra, but because madara got the rinnegan, he has hagoromo’s chakra. Hashirama doesn’t because he never combined Asura and Indra chakra, therefore hashirama as opposed to madara is completely devoid of having any of the Indra and Asura chakra while madara has.

    Did you read what I said??? Hagaromo said Indra and Asura instead of just saying his own chakra. Hagaromo was outright implying that Madara still had both the sons chakra. It stands to reason that Hashirama's chakra never changed too.

    Listen, having asura and indra chakra gives you hagoromo chakra because indra and asura chakra are diluted and seperated forms of his chakra. Adding both indra and asura chakra causes the reunification of both chakra to form hagoromo's chakra, if you can't get that then i don't if you ever will. It doesn't make a difference if madara has indra And asura chakra , because that IS basically hagoromo chakra, one having presence of both chakra's in him basically recreates hagoromo's own chakra. Madara achieved this by biting off hashirama's flesh(who was asura's reincarnate at THAT time) which contained asura chakra, and therefore created a merger between the two to create the rinnegan, you dont get the rinnegan from just indra or ashura chakra, you have to have hagoromo's own chakra to form the rinnegan, so madara combined both to create hagormo's chakra, since the rinnegan is closely tied to hagormo and his power. So it doesn't matter if i say for madara has both indra and asura chakra because that IS hagoromo chakra. If he didn't get the rinnegan he would have none of these chakra,but his own, because he would die and then the indra chakra/transmigrancy would go to sasuke which it already has anyways.

    Hashirama never combined both chakra to get hagoromo's chakra, if he did, then just like madara, he would still keep hagoromo chakra, a prime example is naruto and sasuke, they both received half of hagoromo's chakra, which they still have since it stays with them.

    So to summarize Again: Madara: In his time was indra's reincarnate, while he was indra's reincarnate, he bit off some of hashirama's(who was also asura's incarnate at THAT time) flesh which contained asura chakra, because he only bit a small piece of his flesh he only had a small bit of asura chakra, this meant that it took him near the end of his natural lifespan to awaken the rinnegan and when he did, he also now had hagoromo's chakra(which comprises of both indra and asura chakra) in him. He dies and the indra transmigrancy ends for him with sasuke now becoming the indra reincarnate and having indra's chakra. However there was one caveat, madara had created a complicated situation in which he awakened the rinnegan against the hagoromo's instruction and therefore instead of losing indra's chakra and JUST having his own normal chakra, he kept his hagoromo chakra which he now made his own. Fast forward to the 4th ninja war, madara has basically become the ttj which gives him tb chakra sp/hagoromo chakra you name it. After kaguya gets defeated he is on the ground injured and about to die soon, hagoromo pops out of madara thanks to madara still having remnants of hagoromo chakra(which again is comprised of both indra and asura chakra), towards the end hagoromo tells naruto and sasuke to look on at their previous transmigrants(madara and hashirama) speaking together and whatnot.

    Hashirama: He used to be asura's reincarnate but died later on and lost his asura transmigrancy and chakra, he did NOT have hagoromo(which if i didn't make it clear to you, is comprised of BOTH indra and asura chakra) chakra as he didn't introduce indras chakra into his body from madara, he dies with having the transmigrancy move on from him to naruto.

    What you're saying is completely illogical and is easily disproven, Edo tensei works by summoning the soul and binding their souls into living bodies, Hashirama's soul is Ashura's soul,Edo tensei Hashirama wouldn't exist without Ashura's chakra and soul in him.

    Wait what??? Where on earth did you get this notion of souls from, you got me cracking up.

    It’s ironic you talk about how my comments are supposedly “easily disproven” yet you start bringing in souls? Give me a line, a scan anything that says either madara or hashirama have Indra or ashura souls’ in them, I’m sorry bro but what you just typed in was rubbish.


    Hashirama is a reincarnate of of Ashura, definition of reincarnation:

    Reincarnation is the philosophical or religious concept that an aspect of a living being starts a new life in a different physical body or form after each biological death.

    Hashirama can not exist without Ashura's soul and Chakra in him, I hope you know that your claim of Hashirama not having Ashura's chakra is retarded.


    Wow, it amazing how people go to such lengths to argue their flawed case, you just don't want to admit your wrong, so one more time, show.me.where.it.says.hashirama.has.or.had.asura's.soul. It aint hard to do that surely. Hashirama was asura's previous incarnate, and ceased to be long ago let alone the 4th war, therefore asura's chakra does not reside within him. Your soul point is pure headcanon, even in the anime episode 476 or whatever corresponding manga chapter it is, hagoromo tells naruto and sasuke to look on at their previous reincarnates(hashirama and madara). I dont understand whats hard to comprehend hashirama was asura's reincarnate and thus had his chakra, when he died, the transmigration continued until it reached a new transmigrant host naruto, now hashirama has no asura chakra but naruto does, becuase he is asura's reincarnate. Madara's slightly more complicated but more or less the same. Stop bringing in definitions to back up a flawed argument when we both know most real life concepts don't apply to naruto let alone anime.

    I'm just gonna say it again, the notion of edo tensei Hashirama not having Ashura's Chakra is retarded.

    Hashirama is a reincarnate of Ashura meaning he cannot exist without Ashura's soul and Chakra, Hashirama has Ashura's soul in him, , same thing for hashirama, so pull out some scans to prove me wrong.



     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 12, 2018
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  2. Mindovin Well-Known Member

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    Hashirama probably lost the Asura transmigrancy (is this is even a word?) like Madara as stated by Hagoromo when that chakra go to Naruto.
     
  3. Karyu Endan Smilies = Not serious

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    This is wrong. Naruto did indeed give Sasuke his chakra. It happened when he gave him (along with Jugo) Kurama shrouds in order to take them and the rest of the alliance out of Juubito's AOE blast via Minato's FTG. When the shrouds first appeared C noted to sense them giving off Naruto's chakra signature, and Sasuke and Minato both felt that same chakra all the way from Konoha and identified it as Naruto's too. So the chakra shroud given to Sasuke by Naruto should have Naruto's (and thus Asura's) chakra signature.

    Even if you were to make the argument that Hashirama's chakra would not have awakened the Rinnegan in Sasuke, that doesn't mean that it was given by Hagaromo directly because Sasuke had received Naruto's chakra only minutes beforehand.
     
  4. saidA2000 New Member

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    what? that was just a chakra shroud, that was just chakra being wrapped around them, the chakra didn't actually merge with sasuke's indra chakra, thats ridiculous unless you're stating sasuke started the process of getting the rinnegan after naruto gave him the chakra shroud, unless your just saying he gave them chakra shrouds generally.
     
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