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Alive EMS Madara is relative to The Raikages in speed

Discussion in 'Naruto Battledome' started by The Death & The Strawberry, Sep 14, 2018.

  1. The Death & The Strawberry No Fear

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    Just gonna jump into this.

    I think its a well known fact that the Raikages(especially A3 and a4)are reknown for their crazy speed based off hype and features.

    Madara, while an already accepted physical beast I believe he gets undersold a bit when taking a gauge at his physical stats, mainly speed

    If we compare Naruto's final CQC action with the A3 to the one with Madara:

    Naruto was able to and all before the latter could counterattack, and without any indication of him pressuring him with his speed. To make this feat even more insane this was merely a clone of SM Naruto which only possess a fraction of hs original power, so this wasn't even 100% SM Naruto. Rather then thinking this implies A3's movements are slow(which it obviously isnt because Naruto compared them to A4), it just shows how truly reflective SM Naruto is at this point.

    Though against Madara , and this was a later version of 100% SM Naruto.

    Whether you interpret this as Madara being faster than the third is another thing, but this at the least implies he's in their realm of physical ability especially when relating to speed.

    Another indicator that I believe was hidden in the manga is Edo Madara physically reacting to V2 Ay. To understand the significance of this feat, one must understand the circumstances behind it:

    i. Edo Madara is physically inferior to Alive EMS Madara according to Hashirama and his later physical alive feats.

    ii. Madara was

    iii. despite essentially point blank range) from his face

    Taking all this into consideration, I came to the conclusion that the physically faster alive Madara with his guard up added with his choku tomoe EMS would be capable of physically dodging Ay's strikes.

    Also... to add fire to the flame

    Spoiler:

    Hashirama was potrayed to be in Alive Madara's physical realm, so this kind of transfers to him a little bit as well :hmm


    A number of grammar mistakes but ill edit them out later. Kind of rushed this

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    Srry if I missed you

    You guys agree? What do yall think about this topic
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2018
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  2. The_Conqueror Well-Known Member

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    As lonnng as @Hussain is summoned i dont think others need to be summoned :p
     
  3. Zero890 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, He can react to V2 A4 without any problem and has better feats than A3. He is pretty fast.
     
  4. BlackHeartedImp Well-Known Member

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    I don't think you needed the wealth of evidence you posted. Madara's feats, both while alive and dead, should leave no room for debate honestly.

    He's not seen as a speedster generally but one would be disingenious to say he gets blitzed by or cant keep up with them.
     
  5. Shazam Well-Known Member

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    Madara's physical stats are clearly on pace with the Raikage
     
  6. Jackalinthebox Well-Known Member

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    I agree. He consistently showed top tier reaction speed via reacting to EMS Sasuke, V2 Ay & BM Nardo. When regaining his living self's speed, he also displayed super impressive Shunshin speed with his feat of pressuring SM Naruto more than V1 A3 ever did
     
  7. Hussain Well-Known Member

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    1- Naruto was in fighting position when he faced the 3rd Raikage, hence the counterattack. However, that was not the case with Asspulldara, hence, the block.

    2- Asspulldara's fans are still desperate to say "he blocked V2 A" when we literally have A flat out stating that he will increase his speed next time. What Asspulldara blocked is only V1, which does not say much seeing how even Jugo is capable of doing so. :catshrug
     
  8. sabre320 Well-Known Member

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    His reactions with his ems are very impressive his physical speed is not at v2 level at all though but its above v1.
     
  9. King1 Go Wild

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    He is comparable with A4 V2 due to the fact that he was so fast that SM Naruto with danger sensing could not sense him coming which was why he was blitz. He was faster than naruto's sensing which is an accomplishment
     
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  10. Ghost Of The Uchiha Well-Known Member

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    @The Death & The Strawberry Very nice thread, i agree with you.

    To add to your arguments i would say that living Madara is faster than V1 Ay since he nigh blitzed someone more reflexive (WA SM Naruto) than someone that the Raikage failed to blitz in V1 (3 tomoe Sasuke who even outmaneuvered his attack and was able to land chidori).

    In a weakened Edo form he even reacted to BM Naruto's shunshin and outmaneuvered his attack with the Gunbai.

    He was also able to effortlessly outdo EMS Sasuke with katana in CQC despite being blinded and weaponless albeit with some help from the senjutsu chakra he received from Hashi.

    I agree, at the start of the VOTE battle we see them clashing equally with the Gunbai and the scythe against Hashi's weapons and that Hashi was still in base, so his reflexes would exponentially increase with SM.
     
  11. Android 3:16

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    Why are using the feat of Madara who awakened Hagoromo chakra for living EMS Madara ?

    Because Hashirama said "he regained his past strength" ??? Pretty sure Hashirama had no idea what Madara was doing after the VotE battle.
     
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  12. MaruUchiha The Fourth Six Paths

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    Madara is a bitter defeated dog.. This loser is only as fast as his mouth runs
     
  13. Crimson Flam3s Rampage Sage

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    I agree with this although I thought it was common unspoken knowledge at this point.

    Madara Rekking SM Naruto and not seeming too pressured by unweighted A's speed kinda proved it for me.
     
  14. Orochimaruwantsyourbody Well-Known Member

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    It could be argued that unlocking new levels of doujutsu increases all of the users physical attributes.
     
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  15. Crimson Flam3s Rampage Sage

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    MS Kakashi beyond V3 Raikage speed lvl confirmed.
     
  16. Santoryu Scarecrow

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    I do believe that he's incredibly fast, but elevating him to V2 Ei speed may be pushing it.

    We know that the Sharingan can make one more efficient in close quarters combat/movement. Uchiha Madara has refined his Sharingan superbly, so I'd venture to affirm that his showings are partially attributed to his dojutsu.
     
  17. The Death & The Strawberry No Fear

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    Whether dojutsu played a role or not he'd still require the necessary body speed to physically react

    I never said he's as fast as V2 Ay, but featwise he can very well react to his levels of speed

    Seem to be confusing the context of "speed"

    By speed I don't just mean raw shunsin but physical ability.

    Edit: NVM i thought your post was towards me, but it was for something else :psyduck

    Point still stand though
     
  18. Godaime Tsunade Well-Known Member

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    He wasn’t reacting to V2 A4, or at least, A wasn’t moving at his top speed. He comments after Madara blocks his blow that he’ll have to up his speed if he hopes to land any hits.

    Also, A3 is highly reflexive but his physical movement speed is less impressive. Dodai is able to react to him at close impressive, so Madara outperforming him in this area should be a given.

    A4 > Madara > A3, imo.
     
  19. hbcaptain Well-Known Member

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    I kanda agree with OP.
    Base Hashirama, Madara, Tobirama and Izuna, all of them were most likely equal in terms of base movement speed giving their portrayal as Tobirama speedblitzing either his elder bro or Madara even with Hiraishin support sounds kinda ridiculous.
    In other words, with just 3T/MS, Madara could already exchange blows with ease with someone faster than V2 Ei.
    Raikage being too fast for a teen Sasuke doesn't hold enough weight as a feat to suggest he can do the same to a fully grown adult Mads giving all the elements displayed above.

    Now, add EMS and A4 will look like a turtle, KN0, CS or not, Sasuke was still way below his ancestor at this point of the manga as noted by Oro and proved by feats (ie: his Susano'o level), yet he managed to evolve his dynamic vision and precog to the point he could already follow someone as fast as Juubito (who is at least two tiers above V2 Ei in all speed areas giving his feats against KCM Minato and BSM Naruto) despite struggling a lot against him.

    Being physically faster doesn't mean a lot in a CQC as proved in Naruto&Sasuke fight in VoTE1. Raikage will receive the same treatment as KN0 Naruto when he was up against 3T Sauce. Susano'o isn't even needed for EMS Mad.
     
  20. The Death & The Strawberry No Fear

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    "Upping his speed" by having Onoki augument it with his light boulder jutsu. Otherwise he would have resorted to V2 by himself instead of leaning on Onoki

    I mean think about it, why would A4 resort to V2 against Sasuke when he pulled out the MS but not against a guy that makes him look like an ant? Makes zero sense.
     
  21. King1 Go Wild

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    Ah i see, i based my opinion on the fact that SM Naruto could not react to his blitz while SM Naruto's clone was able to react to A3 blitz. Can SM Naruto react to A4 V2? We lack feat to say A4 can vlitz him without him reacting to it as madara reacted to A4 V2 attack and am sure as an edo he does not have superior reflex to naruto
     
  22. Hussain Well-Known Member

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    He did know about Onoki's plan. He obviously was not talking about that. :sag
     
  23. Godaime Tsunade Well-Known Member

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    No - when A uses his full speed/V2 his hair spikes up. This wasn’t the case when he punched Madara.

    Also, the plan to lighten A and make him faster was Onoki’s, not A’s. A referred to needing to up his speed before Onoki pulled his plan together.

    As we know, A has a bad temper and he’s very impulsive. Against Sasuke, A wanted to quickly and single-handedly kill Sasuke in revenge for his brother. Against Madara they were initially more concerned with stalling him long enough for Tsunade to heal Onoki and Gaara. That’s why he wasn’t going all-out.
     
  24. Hi no Ishi Well-Known Member

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    Madara is definitely on that high level speed tier with A3 and SM Naruto and like many he can block people who are faster than him.
    He can by feats blitz a Jonin level like Sai but will be blocked by a strong Kage level like Naruto from behind

    He was slower than Tobirama but not enough that Tobirama could just blitz him and kill him, but fast enough to always seem to have the advantage over Hashirama in CQC. Stats
    wise I would rate VotE Madara around the same as amped EMS Sasuke as they both have shown the same level of Susano'o.

    I don't consider either founder really above v2 A and they don't have the feats to say they are.
     
  25. Itachiisinvincible Primera Espada

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    IRC, his hair wasn't spiked up during the battle against Minato, despite the fact he was using his full speed.
     
  26. Speedyamell Respect hardwork

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    Nice post.
    @Godaime Tsunade already pointed out the minor errors here and there.
    But what does this make tsunade tho:
     
  27. Speedyamell Respect hardwork

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    You're underplaying sai. And therefore madara in the process.
    Sai blitzed deidara.. I'm pretty sure he's above jonin level
     
  28. WorldsStrongest Dio With It

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    > Speedamell trying to scale Tsunade to V2 Raikage tiers because she hit a CLONE of Madara that WANTED TO BE HIT so Madara could FEINT HER

    Sure bud :facepalm

    Tsunade has 0 impressive speed feats in that fight or anywhere in this manga
     
  29. WorldsStrongest Dio With It

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    I agree with the premise but you really didnt need to go into such detail

    Alive EMS Madara would scale to and HIGHER THAN EMS Sasuke as stated on panel. , and and BM Minato, thats well above what the raikages can consistently do.

    Thats really all that needs to be said regarding Madaras speed and reactions...He scales to and above EMS Sasukes peak...

    His other feats that you pointed do nothing but solidify that claim.
     
  30. Gifted Well-Known Member

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    Blitzed Dedaria? Scans for that
     
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