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Crazy Yondaime Kyuubi Akatsuki Theorum #379

Discussion in 'Naruto Theories' started by Violence Fight, Feb 14, 2005.

  1. Violence Fight

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    alright, now i'll be the first to admit, this theory is A. stretching it abit, and B. semi-half baked(perhaps even Quater-baked if you prefer).

    Alright. So as has been stated the Akatsuki are after Demons, more specifically 9 tails and possibly shukaku. Also as has been discussed, akatsuki does not give a damn about naruto, just what hes got sealed inside of him. So..i was kicking around random brainstorming ideas and heres what I came up with.

    First of all. We can assume by Kisame saying "We'll just hack his limbs off and carry him back"..that theres no need for naruto's physial form, and there MUST be a way to draw out 9tails.

    So this leads me to question, exactly how would one A. Draw out a demon of that power, and B. be able to harness the power.

    My Proposed answer lies in the Ever Unexplained, Uber Secret Jutsu: Shiki Fuujin.

    So, Yondaime uses this particular jutsu to seal Kyuubi into naruto, and allows naruto to draw power from kyuubi so that it can assist him in times of need. So heres what we know about this Jutsu.

    1. It summons the death god
    2. the user sacrifices themselves to seal the target.
    3. Kagebunshin can be used to multiply the effects.
    4. It was able to seal Kyuubi, the "Strongest" of the demons
    5. User is supposedly sealed with the target into the user.(Which isn't true for naruto's case).

    so..the main questions that we need to ask are:A How could Yondaime seal kyuubi into naruto. and B. If the user and target are both sealed together, why have we not seen yondaimes soul in naruto.

    So I propose this interesting concept. Now, we know that the 2 souls sealed supposedly fight for eternity in their resting place. So what if, for example, one soul is crazily stronger than the other soul, lets say for example Kyuubi compared to Yondaime. Now, theorhetically, its quite possible for say the stronger soul to win, and merge the weaker soul into themselves. This would, In essence, create Kyondaime..or a Kyuubi mixed with yondaime.

    Now, your asking "Where am I going with this".

    So lets assume this "Kyuu-daime" is what rests inside of naruto. Now, It would explain why Kyuubi does lend him extra chakra here and there for no reason(for example, the gaara fight, where he had NO chakra left..and Kyuubi gave him the last bit of his chakra...I'm referring to post gama-summoning. When he has to "Wake up Gaara"...). It also explains why, despite detesting naruto and wishing for nothing more than release, he makes subtle comments about Naruto being like the 4th.

    This would be relevant in the fact that A. Shiki Fuujin(Or perhaps a similiar technique) could be used in 2 ways for the akatsuki's goal of getting kyuubi. 1. they assume that the leader of akatsuki stronger mentally/chakra-wise than kyuubi, and can-in essence, over power his sealed soul. or 2. the most logical, have kyuubi released, only to have someone seal it into himself.

    I don't know, I'm just kicking idea's around to try and find some easily speculated answers.
     
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  2. Dyroness

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    O_O..

    That's a nice theory. But even Yondaime, the greatest Shinobi of all time wasn't able to overcome Kyuubi. For it would be necessary someone better than the Fourth. For the lesser youmas, I'm not sure.
    Maybe a different version of Shiki Fuujin?

    Or someone among the Akatsuki who will be the sacrifice? (Using Kage Bunshin to seal multiple demons at the same time?)
    Yondaime's version of Shiki Fuujin isn't very clear, but we can base up stuff from there.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2005
  3. Psycho_Naruto

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    Actually it is said that using the sealing technique, will summon the Death God. Then once the technique is fulfilled (sp?) the target will be sealled and the summoner will die.

    Considering this there is little chance to see Yondaime's soul inside Naruto, since once the summoner dies his soul is taken by the Death God (As Sandaime says it is the price you pay for this technique).

    We also know that Yondaime is the creator of this technique, so he might had better control over it as to where to seal the Kyuubi (unlike Sandaime who as we saw could only seal others into his body).

    There are endless possibilities as to how Yondaime achieved the sealing and I believe even more as to what Akatsuki will do once and if they get their hands on it.
     
  4. drknight

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    Another repetitive unoriginal thread, here goes a biscuit. Call me when you've got something I haven't heard. (lol, sry for the sarcasm)
    Here's some food for thought though (remember where you heard it first).

    BTW: Stop making new threads for discussions that already exists. As a matter of fact since everyone else is doing it I should make my own post on the topic.

    As Posted in: Who is Naruto's Family
    Naruto Is the indeed the Fox. Here we have a reversal of roles. Yondaime's close confrontation (of the Third kind, whatever the hell that means) lead him to realize that the only way to defeat the fox was to seal it within itself. In other words the fox is immortal and cannot be defeated.

    Yondaime's Tactic: Perform a genjutsu capable of tricking the Fox that he is human. This would inevitable lead the fox to retain the form of a human looking like Yondaime (his last memory). Then to seal the fox's "Evil" side by use of the Death God. I will even go as far as to say that Yondaime tricked the fox into thinking he was indeed Yondaime.

    Good Spawning from evil.
    Come to think of it...I like this theory. It plays with the mythology that the Fox is a shapeshifter rather nicely.​

    Note [addition]: The futher elaborate on this theory: Naruto's abilities were crap when he was young because of this Genjutsu. The Genjutsu probably supressed his abilities so that he wouldn't realize that he was the fox.

    If you haven't already, read the pilot. This theory fits in very nicely. You'll see what I mean if you were to read the Mizuki confrontation. ;)
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2005
  5. Violence Fight

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    Well, the first thing I would love to point out, is that you should've known it was going to be unoriginal(Atleast alittle), due to the title(Hell, I even numbered iit..seeing as every day 7-10 more akatsuki theories pop up). Second I would like to say that the stuff I said I have not seen used the same way which I have used it(otherwise I wouldn't have posted a useless thread when theres 9 million out there). NO offense intended, just explaining myself. (also I explained it was a hal-quarter baked theory which I was just kicking around..more brainstorming than anything ;p)


    Your info/Theory fits nicely with the genjutsu concept/fox power supression idea, but theres a few holes in it that keep it at mid-probability level(My own theory(ies) are at Low-to-very low probability level). The main holes I see in the genjutsu theory are these. First Yondaime sealing the Evil Side of the fox. 2 sides are part of the same soul, so unless Yondaime used the shiki fuujin to drag out the evil part of the foxes soul and then have the shinigami cut just that part, theres no way to just seal the "Evil Part" with the shiki fuujin. Now, lets assume that the shiki fuujin in any form will kill the user of the technique(I say form becuase there are sure to be, as with all techniques, variations of the SF based on situation..like the Kage Bunshin Shiki Fuujin). So we either have A. Yondaime using a different sealing technique to seal the evil part away. or B. Yondaume tricks the fox into using the technique on itself through genjutsu(Similiar to kakashi's Suggestive Illusion during the wave country arc).

    In A's case. Yondaime is considered dead. Therefor he couldn't have used a technique that didn't result in suicide. The only technique that he's been credited as using seal wise(Infact the third says "This technique is from the hero who saved our village"..or something to that extent..and although my memory is spotty, I believe he might actually mention it as "The fourths technique in the same fight") was shiki fuujin. thus meaning Yondaime would be dead...UNLESS...

    B. He tricks the fox into using Shiki Fuujin through genjutsu. Yondaime would Also "Still be Alive"(assuming he wasn't fatally wounded before doing this..I'm sure we'll get to see this as its a major part of the storyline..and that will clear things up). Second, despite immortality..If the fox were to use this technique on itself it would kill itself. Period. I mean, this isn't like "Oh I'm immortal, I'll just step infront of this bus and walk away" this is "I"ll go ahead and FEED MY SOUL TO THE GOD OF DEATH". Since We know the technique indeed offerse up the users soul to said god as a cost for using it. This also brings up the question as to "Where" naruto's own soul/mind came from, since if a soul is sealed into something, it can't exactly directly affect the body unless the seal is made like the one yondaime used(since the way his seal was written, allows chakra to seep in and out and mix). So If we have a person soul SEALED in their own body, despite the form..then they still would not be able to move their limbs..since the soul is sealed.

    HOWEVER. this allows me to think of another interesting concept. What if, The fox was tricked into thinking that He was yondaime, and that Yondaime was the fox. And thus, used Shiki Fuujin on Yondaime. This would mean that inside the Kyuubi's now Yondaime looking form, resides his and Yondaime soul. This could lead to the old "Naruto=Yondaimes Reincarnation" theory..as perhaps yondaime was able break free enough to give naruto a small soul or atleast spark a flame of life in the now lifeless Kyuubi-Henge'd-Into-Yondaime-Form. This would explain a few things aswell. Such as naruto Insane level fo battle judgement(His random spurts of very VERY talented planning in dire situations), and his Yondaime like qualities.

    In essence the reincarnated soul of Yondaime would be controlling the now Henge'd Fox's body. Which would in essence combine both theories effectively.

    But I don't know, I'm rambling again.

    I'm not trying to disprove what was said. Nor am I trying to prove that I'm right. I'm just taking in the concepts of what you said and trying to root out possible flaws and/or explain possibilities that could surmount from this concept. Anythings possible at this point, hell, naruto could be an alien from the planet naruto that landed the night before Kyuubi attacked, and gets his mystic power through the yellow sun from the earth and his tail..which was inexplicably cut off by his newfound mother...
     
  6. Uzumaki^Naruto

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    Occam's razor cuts all your theories apart ... im for the plane reincarnation theory
     
  7. Rougtan

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    I think you all are looking WAY to in depoth with this. We will find out who Naruto is/ who is his family when he wants us to. Until then, sit back and enjoy the ride.
     
  8. drknight

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    Cool out, violence fight! I was just kidding by what i said. I though you would notice my sarcasm. Anyways... the criticism is much appreciated. Guess I have to think a little more on it's development.


    This I must point out though: All theories up to this about about Naruto's beginnings have "holes," just thought I'd let you know. ;)
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2005
  9. ramp3

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    Kyuubi lend the chakra because if Naruto dies, he dies too.
    I don't think kyuubi and yondaime are mixed.
     
  10. drknight

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    Is it possible that Fuuinjutsu Shiki Fuujin never even worked, so he resorted to using a supresser seal on the fox in his last moments of life?
     
  11. j_god

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    sound theory!!

    i've always been iffed with the fact that the seal that the 3rd used says that.. "the sealer.. and the sealed will fight IN THE BELLY OF THE DEATH GOD" not is someone/something else's belly..

    there's something really wrong with the sealing of the kyuubi in naruto's belly.. unless naruto.. IS THE DEATH GOD..
     
  12. drknight

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    Typical of a God To say...
    lol
     
  13. j_god

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    well for some of us that have lives and wasn't able to read all the threads from its conception.. this is a very very nice theory.. highly stretched.. but very nice.. an immortal genjutsu fooling the fox to be naruto?! nice..
     
  14. Violence Fight

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    I noticed the sarcasm. I did type "No offense"...and I really didn't mean anything by my post as far as attempting to offend you. Just..discussion. thats all it was. Not trying to argue, just trying to figure things out.

    And yes, everything has holes. S'why they are "Theorums", becuase we can't prove them..becuase to prove them, they'd need to lack holes(Although in Anime/Manga...Holes in the plot don't necessarily mean anything ;p )
     
  15. ayuready

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    i seriously think that they are just going to use naruto as a battery/generater to make an army of edo tensei zombies


    haha roxor theory?
     
  16. Katara

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    A. Unseal the Kyuubi. When Naruto stole the scroll in ep1/chapter1, the Third was afraid that he'd accidentally unseal himself and transform into the Kyuubi. :moment of fantasizing: :smile-big That's one way to draw out the demon.

    Another idea I've been toying with is that sooner or later, Naruto may learn/create some sort of Summoning Jutsu for the Kyuubi. I've opted for that one, but there's no proof whatsoever to lead in that line of reasoning, except that the seal on his stomach could be used for the summoning, like the mark on Orochimaru's left arm. (I know, completely out there, but I have my rights. :) )

    B. That's probably one of the items that Akatsuki is looking for. In chapter 97, Gaara mentions that Shukaku had been sealed inside a kettle. Before I read the translation for 247, I thought that was what they were after but now maybe that's just another reason for attacking the Sand Village, besides Gaara.

    Also, another idea I've been thinking about is the Tsukiyomi/Amaterasu that Itachi mentioned. He said that he should not use it until the "Moon" becomes the "Sun." I was thinking that it meant that darkness would be the prevalent time of day for things to flourish (opposed to daylight)--maybe that's why the black fire technique he used took so much out of him. Anyway, maybe they can control the Kyuubi once that happens also. Or they need the Kyuubi to do it. :/
     
  17. Green Lantern

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    this whole thread brings another theory
    how does one create and teach a jutsu if using it kills them?
    how could yondaime have created a jutsu which will kill him when he uses it and how could he teach someone else wat that jutsu does?
     
  18. Therahedwig

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    I've been wondering that a lot too...but I figured the seal must've been compleetly theoretical...

    I have also a theory that the seal the third used was the seal the 4th created, but that the 4th's seal was based on a much older jutsu, that the 4th used against the kyuubi...since actually one is an improvised version of the other, and it would make more sense for yodaime to use a seal he knows that works(but requires a vessel like naruto) then risking to use a seal that might not work against the kyuubi...
     
  19. ShadowZ?

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    yea that is what i sad b4 in narutomania but already been deleted
     
  20. Naruto329

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    Not possible for many reasons.....I would say but don't know if you know or not just know it's not possible for Yondaime to be sealed within Naruto with Kyuubi you probably don't even know The fourth hokages real name and I mean his actuall name not Yondaime
     
  21. saintshinoda

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    lol.. this thread is too old... dint they already show everything (anime/manga) ?
     
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