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current state aizen, gin, and tousen

Discussion in 'Bleach' started by Ralphy♥, May 29, 2007.

  1. Ralphy♥ 愛あなた永遠あな

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    I been pondering this for quite some time. As you all know Aizen has reached the peak of his "shinigami" powers and can't progress any further without somehow breaking the barrier between shinigami and hallow. Around the end of Save rukia arc, i would say that out of the three that left only aizen had maxed his power out. It would be sence-able to think that aizen may have helped gin & tousen reach full power. Heres my main point. At present "meaning this point in the manga" does anyone think Aizen, Gin, or tousen have gained hallow abilities much like a vizard? Or have at least attempted to gain these abilities?

    Thoughts?
     
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  2. Zaru ________________________________ Retired Staff

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    I think Aizen is still waiting for the full awakening of the hougyouko.

    Although his powers would be insane, then.
     
  3. YamiB. GoSpieler

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    As they were taken in by the hollows and have taken lead over such a powerful group it would stand to reason that they have expanded their powers to some degree by taking them into the territory of hollow abilities. Though they may not complete their transition until the Hogyoku has regained its full power. I don't know if it is necessarily true that Gin and Tousen reached the peak of Shinigami power before this took place. They may be able to continue strengthening themselves in that area while delving into the realm of hollow powers.
     
  4. Ralphy♥ 愛あなた永遠あな

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    Speaking on the Hougoku. I thought the Hougoku only pertained to the development of arrancar. As seen with the vizard group none "that we know of" came to obtain hollow powers using the hougoku.
     
  5. wiplok Wonderful.

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    aizen powers are already insane :OOOO
    about gin and tousen, not really sure if they became vaizards or something, i mean, did they joined aizen cuz they wanted power?
     
  6. YaoiLOVER Banned

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    But as a vaizard his powers will be insaner :omg
     
  7. Ralphy♥ 愛あなた永遠あな

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    So anyone believe that Aizen, gin, and tousen at present may already have vizard powers? Or have atleast tried or are still in development for these powers.
     
  8. wiplok Wonderful.

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    true

    i dont think so, i mean, being aizen as patient as he is, he's prolly gonna wait for the hogyoku's full awakening to do it on himself
    and about gin and tousen, we dont even know if they have the same goals of aizen, and even if they want, do they need to get more powerfull? since aizen has their back.like what happened with that grim vs tousen thing, when tousen cut grim's arm, grim couldnt do nothin, tousen could be pissing all over grim's face he couldnt do nothing, cuz he knows if he did, aizen would be all over his ass like a spider-monkey
    and dont get me wrong, im not taking sides, im just stating a fact :huh
     
  9. Krog Mad Scientist

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    Seeing Azien fight his hollow self would be awesome. :nuts
    I sure hope we'll be able to witness his vizard transformation. :woo
     
  10. SiSL The Hun

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    I have a feeling Tousen is onto something else goal rather than following Aizen blindly(!, pun intended) so I'm not sure if he is willing to sacrifice his shinigami self to become more powerful.
     
  11. CM Pope The Holy Father

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    Aizen's power is already OVER 9,000!!!!!!!

    I think he's being careful and waiting for a 100% OoD to make himself in to a Vaizard only when he's sure it can work.
     
  12. radioactive_granny all the birds are moving...

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    LOL! I just wanted to write how come nobody posted some thing like IT's OVER 9000!!!111 :laugh
     
  13. Ralphy♥ 愛あなた永遠あな

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    I still don't understand how the hougoku would help Aizen gain hollow powers. None of the vizards used the hougoku, so Aizen really doesnt need it right?

    Also is the hougoku backwards compatible? The hougoku is giving hollows shinigami powers, but some think aizen will use it to gain hollow powers. Does this mean the hougoku works both ways?
     
  14. AbnormallyNormal 1 + 2 + 3 = 1 * 2 * 3

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    i think they're probably waiting until the orb is "perfected" before they use it on themselves, plus we dont even know if a shinigami can become a vizard with that method, although it seems plausible.
     
  15. Metric Jay Chou tard

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    The Hougyoku blurs the line between hollow and shinigami, so it works in making Arrancars as well as the other way in making Vizards. We don't know how the Vizards got their hollow forms, though i suspect Urahara had something to do with it - like how Ichigo got his Vizard power through Urahara's training technique.

    I think Aizen has yet to use the Hougyoku on himself, and he'll only do it once its fully ready. Tousen has had a power icrease since SS arc, so i wouldn't be surprised if he has been Hougyoku'd.
     
  16. BAD BD ...

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    I think Gin and Tousen have already been partialy turned into hollows. Gin almost got beaten by Hitsuga and Tousen was nearly killed by Zaraki. The only way that they can F*ck with Arrancrar power was if they were vaizards themsleves.

    Luppi Grimjows repacement could fight Hitsuga easily in Bankai. ( Luppi could have easily killed him. Have you noticed that all of the espada get beaten just because they are way too cocky and toy with their opponents before they kill them. Rukia-Aaronieo, The Shinigami- Luppi, pollo- Renji Ishida.)

    I think Aizen is alerady at Vaizard level but not a Vaizard. I think he is waiting for the full power of the Hougoku to make himslf the perfect mix.

    Does anyone else think that the reason Ichigo became a Vaizard was because his powers were activated by Rukia's and she had the hougoku inside her. Plus I don't think she had the power destroying gigai yet.
     
  17. Urahara Banned

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    I think Aizen will activate the Hougekyou upon himself at the very last moment, as in when he's on the verge of defeat, via at the hands of either Ichigo or whomever, which would stall him for time...along with tremendously boosting his power.

    Think of it as a last-ditch effort motive.
     
  18. kaz Active Member

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    Aizen will wait for the Hougyoku to be at fully awakened before he uses it on himself.

    As for Gin and Tousen, they haven't shown me anything to be considered "strong."
     
  19. Ralphy♥ 愛あなた永遠あな

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    Tousen = Cut grimjaw's reitsu tempered arm effortlessly

    "strong" indeed
     
  20. Aflean Murdering, in cold blood, a

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    I think they will need some kind of power-up.

    We've learnt that Aizen has reached his peak as a Shinigami and wants more, but that doesn't mean that Yama-jii hasn't reached his peak, he could just simply be fine with him reaching his peak. Gin has yet to show any kind of power, his Bankai could be broken.

    As for Tousen, I'm still not sure why Aizen didn't just kill him back in SS, instead of bringing him to HM and faffing around, maybe because Tousen's Bankai has something in it that Aizen fears could harm him, maybe it's because he wanted another shinigami companion, maybe he didn't want to get SS even more worked up about the Ryoka's, but we have seen that Tousen's power is nothing too special, with Grimmjaw's arm, he had the element of surprise. For example, in the end of the first Arrancar wave attack on Earth, when Grimmjaw came down, Renji said that if he hadn't had the element of surprise, and if he had fought with his limit lifted from the beginning, then he might not of won, hence proving how important surprise can be.

    Tousen cutting off Grimmjaw's arm has been a surefire way for Kubo Taito to try and tell lovers that Tousen has had some kind of powerup, but he did leave clues like the surprise thing as well.

    I hope that Tousen has had some sort of powerup, as his Bankai, in a war, would be quite useless, as people could pop it from the outside.

    Aizen is obviously still obscenely powerful, and we have no reason to believe otherwise, people still hanging onto the "illusion" conspiracy can shut themselves up, as Kubo Taito wouldn't do something like that.

    Their forms must have increased in power to some extent otherwise they wouldn't be any help to Aizen during the Winter War, and would have been killed and left somewhere before-hand.

    I realise I have gone off on a tangent and most of my points weren't completely to the point... but i've just realised how fast I can type while lying on my arm and not looking at the keyboard at all... the result is... bullshit to a large extent, with a little meaning.

    Anyway, I think that they have had some sort of powerup, and I think that IChigo will have another powerup soon, and that everyone will have some significance in the Winter War, whether being Urahara or Hanatarou.

    -- Eliot --
     
  21. Ralphy♥ 愛あなた永遠あな

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    Aizen wouldnt kill people devoted to his cause. Dont include momo in this because she was infatuated with Aizen. Something Gin & Tousen are not.

    Plus Gin & Tousen left there sacred position for search of higher power with Aizen. Aizen see's them as loyal comrades. He may think of them as on the same level as he is. Not power wise, understanding wise. common goal type thing.
     
  22. Aflean Murdering, in cold blood, a

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    Yo, Gun, no way does Aizen see them on the same level. Mate, you've seen Aizen's throne, right? You've seen how he talks down to Tousen, it's quite obvious he sees nothing at his height any more, not even the King of SS.

    He only sees pawns, he is fine with them being on his side, but he sure as hell does not see them as comrades, just underlings.

    -- Eliot --
     
  23. Ralphy♥ 愛あなた永遠あな

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    Good point

    I don't remember him talking down to Tousen though. Also remember when Aizen talked to Gin about completing the espada and stuff. He relaid a plan that Gin is in on. That must hold some trust and "same level on understanding, you can here my plan" type thing. Well out of all HM, Aizen most likely trust tousen and gin most.
     
  24. kaz Active Member

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    That is why Aizen stopped Grimmjow from attacking Tousen. Real strong.
     
  25. Aflean Murdering, in cold blood, a

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    You don't remember him talking down to Tousen? His reaction when Tousen started trying to get Grimmjaw executed could point to this heirarchy dispute...

    I think that afterwards, when Tousen cut off Grimmjaw's arm and burned it, and Aizen said nothing about it, could have been because Aizen doesn't want to show the weakness of his "shinigami subordinates" in front of his Arrancar. If he had attacked and stopped Tousen in front of them with little effort, then some of the Espada would get the idea that they could be on speaking terms with Aizen, instead of listening to his plans at the table, as I'm sure some of the Arrancar wants.

    I have no dispute about Aizen trusting Tousen and Gin most, and I have no evidence to show that Aizen looks down to Gin, as Gin's nature makes him on happy-chatty terms with Aizen. Aizen certainly trusts them the most in HM, but I don't think he would tell them his most inner plans much time before he would tell the rest of the Arrancar.

    -- Eliot --
     
  26. Ralphy♥ 愛あなた永遠あな

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    Yea i guess that was pretty cheap, but you gotta admit, Aizen looked like a DON when he told grimjaw he can't forgive him if he attacked tousen.
     
  27. Homura Puella Magi

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    I'm betting you that Aizen used the orb on themselves to make them Vaizards. I wouldn't be surprised if they are.
     
  28. Aflean Murdering, in cold blood, a

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    @ Karin (lucky name) them being Vaizards would mean that they would have had to have joined with a Hollow, if so, do you think that they joined as soon as they could to throw around their authority, or do you think that they are waiting until they can join with a Vasto Lorde?
     
  29. Protect_The_Butter Banned

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    Tousen didn't surprise Grimmjow. He was staring at him the whole time he did it. Grimm just thought to highly of himself and got put in his place. We saw him do the same thing when he tried ignore Aizen and walk out the war room. It ended in him getting floored by Aizens reiatsu.
     
  30. Aflean Murdering, in cold blood, a

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    Shut up, hated newbie XD. Jokes

    I think that Tousen did surprise Grimmjaw, what with Grimmjaw doing nothign to stop it and his memorable cries of "MY ARM! MY ARM! YOU BASTARD! WHAT DID YOU DO TO MY ARM! AAAARRRGH!" If he saw the cut coming, he's a bloody good actor, and comitted as well, to let his arm come off while acting...

    Not trying to invalidate your opinion or anything, but he did suprise him... And not sure what your link back to the Aizen reiatsu incident has on this process...

    Anyway, got to go, all, need sleep. It's 03:50 where I am...

    -- Eliot --
     
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