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Is anyone else underwhelmed with Chrollo?

Discussion in 'Hunter x Hunter' started by Saitou Hajime, Jul 17, 2017.

  1. Saitou Hajime Active Member

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    Ever since Chrollo fought the Zoldycks, he has received extreme hype with regards to what he would be like if he fought for real. In versus debates, match ups involving him often bring up the caveat of Skill Hunter's theoretical contents for either his victory or good showing against a superior opponent. Fast forward to his first major death match in the series, the long-awaited confrontation with Hisoka, and yet this serious Chrollo we've been dying to see is a bit... anticlimactic, I suppose. Almost all of the abilities he utilized appears to be new, casting doubt on that alleged arsenal of reserve hax inside Skill Hunter. The abilities he did use, while effective and functional, were a tad conventional and didn't live up to the extraordinary hype that was bestowed upon them. He fought a relatively "safe" fight, never engaging in direct CQC unless under cover of deterrence and back up.

    I'm not saying that he didn't fight a smart, effective, and dominant fight, or that the abilities and strategy that used were necessarily bad. It's just that it didn't quite live up to what I thought the hype said it would IMO.
     
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  2. Intus Legere ̣#TeamHisoka

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    Hmmm... no, not me. Hisoka vs. Chrollo is actually one of my favorite fights ever. Though I'd like to see a bit more of CQC in Chrollo's next fight.

    Personally, I feel like they were incredible. Exactly because they aren't powerful by themselves, but in combination they are superb. Kind of like Bungee Gum seems like a stupid power, but Hisoka turns it into a fantastic tool.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2017
  3. charles101 Well-Known Member

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    I think everyone agree that fight was amazing. It's outcome what grinds people's gears. Gomu Gomu no: Edo Tensei.
     
  4. Yasha Procreate

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    I see it differently. I think it's an absolutely ingenious way out of a death match between two very popular characters that pleases both fanbases.

    1) Togashi fulfilled the promise of a death match by killing one character.
    2) The revival fit the established framework that nen continues to work after user's demise. No asspull ala Fairy Tail.
    3) Hisoka's method actually makes sense from medical point of view. It works like a self-imposed CPR.
    4) Hisoka's method is only plausible with his unique hatsu. There is no concern that other future dead characters can also come back to life through the same way. So it doesn't open a floodgate which reduces the impact of important character's death in the manga.
     
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  5. charles101 Well-Known Member

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    It's more like he didn't want to piss off Hisoka fans who might have dropped the manga. Nobody's dead so he fulfilled nothing. I'm pretty sure that from medical point of view his brain would be dead in minutes after "death". It's due to his hatsu, right but it's just stupid. His power is manipulating gum and somehow he used it to revive himself. Sure there's way to explain it, but I simply don't buy this (imo) crap. Kishimoto somehow explained that Tobi was Obito and still, it's just stupid. And he can use this cheap trick again. We have Killua with electric Hatsu, Bisky with healing Hatsu, etc. He may do same thing again and give it another, farfetched explanation.
     
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  6. Extravlad Well-Known Member

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    The fact that he had to borrow 2 abilities from his fellow troupe members is a huge let down, he shouldn't need to borrow anything from them when he has a book full of abilities.
     
  7. Alex Payne a Char

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    I was extremely pleased with his showings. Tactician of the highest degree. As for his moves not really being worthy of the hype - it is quite possible that he had one or two extremely potent/flashy moves in his book but: 1) He was fighting while hundreds of people were watching and didn't want them to see much 2) Those abilities aren't as effective vs Hisoka in particular 3) He had them prepared as a fail-safe.
     
  8. vicucha Vicky

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    Everyone bitter about Hisoka bieng alive plays it out as if the people who like Hisoka are the whiny ones and as if Togashi did it to please them but the only whiny ones to me seem to be the people who wanted Hisoka dead, which tend to be Chrollo fans actually.

    I seriously don't get why it is so hard to understand Togashi keeping Hisoka alive? Hisoka is much more tied to Gon than Chrollo is, not to mention that Hisoka is more easily integrated with whatever set of characters Togashi needs him to due to his personality, unlike Chrollo who is more detached and elusive and more Phantom Troupe limited. So IMO it makes sense that Togashi would want to keep Hisoka around. What would he fullfill by killing him other than proving Chrollo is stronger which he already proved by him winning and technically killing Hisoka. You make it seem as if him staying dead would make such a great difference when it doesn't tbh. If the series had been close to its ending, yeah Hisoka dying would make perfect sense for me but the series isn't ending despite hiatuses so I'm not surprised Togashi kept him alive cause I don't see Hisoka dying before the climax of the story. That does't mean I think Chrollo isn't important, but I can see why despite Chrollo being stronger, at this moment, Hisoka is still more useful for the story.
     
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  9. charles101 Well-Known Member

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    Actually I really like Hisoka and don't give a single damn about Chrollo.

    About rest, why even set up 1 on 1 fight to death if you don't wanna kill anyone in the first place?
     
  10. Intus Legere ̣#TeamHisoka

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    I'm a Hisoka fan and I'd never drop the manga if Hisoka died there. Actually, I was pretty displeased with Hisoka's OH MY RUBBER NEN moment. I know many other Hisoka fans who felt pretty much the same.

    I love Meruem, but I don't want him to revive. His death was beautiful. And Hisoka dying in that match would be perfectly fine, as long as Togashi made it worth it.

    Also, from your post above, you seem to confirm the tendency. I don't think Togashi was afraid oof losing readers. Maybe he didn't have the actual guts to kill Hisoka because he couldn't bring himself to do it, or because he's have removed one of HxH's best characters.
     
  11. Gohara Ryutoshi

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    Chrollo Lucilfer is one of the most impressive characters in the series in my opinion. His Nen Abilities are some of the most powerful in the series but I think that's partially what dictates his fighting style. He sort of has to sit back and strategize a lot because so many of his Abilities require different and multiple conditions to be met. Having to put together a strategy based on all those variables is complex especially when matching up against characters of Hisoka's caliber.
     
  12. Diivil1 New Member

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    I neither agree nor disagree with your opinion
     
  13. Oz Green days are not gone

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    Hisoka is my favorite character, and eventhough i didn't like the way he fought, if chrollo had really wanted hisoka to die he would have given him a final blow or beheaded him.

    but, chrollo vs hisoka is easily the best fight we have witnessed in this manga so far.

    and i still think chrollo has some more things to offer as well.
     
  14. Yasha Procreate

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    Not fine at all. Hisoka's purpose in the manga is more critical than many people realize. He's a threat to the protagonists in Hunter Exam, a goal to Gon in Sky Tower, an ally to Gon in Greed Island, an ally to Kurapika in Yorkshin, a wild card in Election Arc and a loose cannon in Dark Continent. His versatility is one of the main reasons HxH story is so varied and hard to predict. Killing Hisoka will seriously limit the paths Togashi can take in his storytelling. In comparison, Chrollo is more dispensable as a character.
     
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  15. Intus Legere ̣#TeamHisoka

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    I agree, Hisoka was a big part in Gon's story. But Gon's story might (MIGHT) be over. If Gon doesn't recover his powers, then there will be no rematch: Gon vs. Hisoka.

    Not only that, Yorkshin arc only happened because of Hisoka. Still, his heavy contribution to the manga, past Yorkshin, becomes minor. It's something of the past. He might become a central piece in the plot again, but currently he is not.

    I fully agree with that.

    I disagree. Hisoka was more dispensable. At that point of the manga, at least, he was. Chrollo still had a things to explain: his own motivations, the Ryodan motivations and Meteor City. He also has ties with Kurapika's story, which is far from over.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2017
  16. Yasha Procreate

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    :huh

    Of course Gon will recover his nen. Unless Togashi kills the manga prematurely.

    I look forward to Gon vs Gyro more than a rematch with Hisoka tbh.
     
  17. Intus Legere ̣#TeamHisoka

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    I said MIGHT. It's a possibility, but I don't mean it's likely.

    Yes, I look forward to seeing these events too, but the point is that Gon story as a hunter could end right there and it would feel complete. I don't think Gon will take part on the present arc, since he has no ties or motivation to get involved so far.

    I kind of have a feeling that neither Hisoka nor Chrollo are going to survive the journey to the Dark Continent. So maybe there won't be a Gon vs. Hisoka final showdown. Just a hunch.
     
  18. Jackalinthebox Well-Known Member

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    Chrollo displayed really impressive speed, top tier intelligence and a pretty insane aura reserve. Yeah, he't not RG level or anything, but nothing ever really implied he was.

    However; he fought Silva in the past and mentioned that he was known for his use of Skill Hunter, so he definitely has at least one or two strong abilities that have yet to be shown
     
  19. The Mathemagician Headshot Productions

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    Tbh, I became a Chrollo fan from his fight with Hisoka. Not my favorite fight in HxH (that goes to Everyone VS Youpi for me), but it truly displayed just how dangerous Chrollo is as a person and a tactician. Hisoka let Chrollo set the terms and Chrollo took full advantage and essentially had that fight from the start. Nice way to show off Chrollo's intelligence.
     
  20. Dr. White Smell nice? it's Moonflower

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    Nope, I absolutely loved what I got from him. Chrollo had already shown that he was fit to rumble with people physically even if he's not the uber offensive type. I like how he picked his openings to engage in CqC which was pretty much a must vs Hisoka due to bungee gum. As for his books moves, I think he chose shalnark's for the express purpose of gaining the initial advantage (hisoka claimed that manipulating others to fight for you is pretty much one of the strongest strategies) of thwarting bungee gum set up and being able to create distance, and Kurtopi's with the express intent of using the crowd against Hisoka. The body double stuff was great because it made Hisoka believe in false perceptions and commit to certain moves which came back to bite him in the ass, and sun and moon was great because of the threat over time and space aspect, as you always have to be wary of any two potentially tagged things making contact.

    I'm sure Chrollo has some other cool moves, but he wanted to set up a 100% victory and do so pretty inconspicuously which heaven's arena was perfect for given both fighters were already familiar with the setting, so he focused on efficiency.
     
  21. Yasha Procreate

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    How many people can guarantee a 100% win against Hisoka? Probably less than 10 in the world.
     
  22. Masa Active Member

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    If the place and time was decided and Hisoka was sure to come because of wanting to fight a strong opponent, it wouldn't be so difficult. Just set up a miniature rose to blow up the arena when the match begins and be a safe distance away.
     
  23. Don King Knights of Ren

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    Hunter Skill is so OP that inorder for Kurapika to defeat him was the stolen abilities. Even Hisoka is having a hard time which eventually result to death.
     
  24. Yasha Procreate

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    ......

    No foul play involved.
     
  25. Masa Active Member

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    That would negate Chrollo's win over Hisoka.
     
  26. Yasha Procreate

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    He beat him fair and square.
     
  27. Masa Active Member

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    Sure, if you consider setting a trap fair and square, but in that case, Noob Gon beat Genthru fair and square, Netero tied with Meruem fair and square, and Razor beat the whole phantom troupe at once fair and square. Of course, for most people fair and square means not giving a huge setting and prep advantage to one side and not allowing abilities that don't really have much use in a neutral setting.
     
  28. Dr. White Smell nice? it's Moonflower

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    What bullshit is this lmao? Chrollo used his abilities to take control of the location which hisoka agreed to. He didn't have any prep time to "set traps" and created the space and time needed to kick his strategy into gear by his own means of pressuring hisoka.

    Netero literally had a nuke pre programmed into his body prior to the fight and said nuke was technology, not apart of his nen skills kr regular abilities..
     
  29. Masa Active Member

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    He didn't set traps, the whole scenario was a trap. Just because Hisoka accepted doesn't make it a fair fight. Most of the abilities in the fight that Chrollo used are useless in a 1v1 and some of them were only borrowed. I doubt he was planning on keeping them after the fight and most likely has lost them now that their owners are dead.

    Who says a fight has to be purely nen abilities? Chrollo used a poisoned knife against Silva and Gon used a greed island card to beat genthru, you do whatever you have to do to win. However, that doesn't make any of those fights, including Chrollo v Hisoka fair and square.
     
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  30. Intus Legere ̣#TeamHisoka

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    @Masa :

    (1) Chrollo defeated Hisoka using his own powers (Skill Hunter is a hatsu to use other people's abilities), and borrowing abilities from friends is also a valid option; none of Chrollo's powers besides Skill Hunter and Double Face are actually his own creation, and I don't know why you'd consider borrowing powers as wrong but stealing powers as ok.
    (2) Hisoka also accepted it to be a deathmatch, meaning the match would only end with one's death and contestants were allowed to go outside of the ring.

    So, was it a fair game? For me, sure it was. It may be a game where Chrollo had a home turf advantage, but it's still part of the game -- no rules were broken. It wouldn't be fair and square if Chrollo used help from the outside, or used weapons that aren't allowed.

    Then again, it all depends on what you mean by "fair and square". You seem to include a neutral battlefield in your definition "fair and square". However, if you follow that definition, football matches aren't fair either.
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2017

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