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Is the Raid a good idea?

Discussion in 'Ohara Library' started by Sabo, Aug 2, 2020.

  1. Sabo

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    Most of the heavy hitter are fighting Kaido right now. Is this the best possible strategy? Not to mentioned Big Mom and King is near by.

    Wouldn’t it be better to isolate and assasinate Kaido’s All Stars and the Six one by one over the last few days? Once Kaido is alone, they can work out how to kill him later.

    Next chapter that group will be overwhelm by two Youkou. Big Mom will impregnate a few of them.

    The group needs a true war strategist to lead them.
     
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  2. Muah

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    Maybe Yamato is a war strategist since Sanji and Usopp never stepped up to the plate. Though its clearly established the alliance has no idea what to do with big mom and Luffy is relying on luck. Instead of Luffy saying hey I want my four strongest men to distract big mom or hey I should call my alliance.

    Luffy sucks as a captain.
     
  3. Sabo

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    All they need is Karyo Ten to win this strategically. If Ousen, Riboku or SBK is there, they low dif two Yonkou. @Amol
     
  4. GrizzlyClaws

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    Well Sanji tried this with P1 earlier and look how that turned out. :pepehype
     
  5. Sabo

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    Sanji should stick with Sheephead in this strategy.

    The assassin approach means you need low dif battles to save strength for the battle with Kaido and Big Mom later.


    So 2 Nova vs 1 Six level guy
    Cat, Dog, Ashura vs Jack
    Marco +Luffy attack Queen
    Marco, Luffy and all Yonkou 3M level guys gang up on King
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2020
  6. Amol

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    Well this is shonen. Good guys don't assassinate people here. Rinko Style Strategy only works in Seinen manga where everybody understands that war is not pretty and you do everything and anything to win it.
    Luffy doesnt roll that way. He was the same guy who was telling Admiral from where he was going to attack because he thought it wasn't honorable thing to attack a blind man. Well Luffy is lucky. He already gained strong ally in Yamato. Things would work out for him eventually.
    *SHK not SBK.
    Ousen would be pretty disappointed on just how lax security Beast Pirates have. Kaido literally had no idea until he was jumped on by 9 people trying to kill him.
    Ousen probably would be like.
    Spoiler:



    He will also see Luffy as
    Spoiler:


     
  7. Sabo

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    Yeah Luffy doesn’t roll that way. Just use Luffy as bait then. Lol

    And maybe not assasinate, just beat them up and capture them or something.
     
  8. Descent of the Lion

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    I think it would be smarter to attack them all at once at different locations. Staggering the assassinations will only increase the alert level of the compound once people catch on. Make sure the bulk of offensive power is concentrated on Kaido and Big Mom and keep his underlings busy with competent warriors.
     
  9. Sabo

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    That’s almost exactly what they are doing right now...
     
  10. Corax

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    This manga isn't about assassins. This is a classic shounen,so they always fight head on regardless of disadvantage. Well and always win since plot.
     
  11. Great Potato

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    So are they just supposed to let Momonosuke get executed while they spend days sneaking around trying to pick off everyone one by one and hope that somehow nobody notices the top elites are all mysteriously disappearing? Good luck trying to take down King quietly without causing a scene, or betting everything on Luffy, Zoro, and Kid being able to stay off the grid without exposing themselves.
     
  12. Sabo

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    I said picked them off over the last few days.
     
  13. Sabo

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    And why are you guys keep saying the shounen should be this, or Luffy's personality won't do that. That is true, that is why they attacked the way the did, but doesn't change the fact that it is a terrible strategy and they could have done better with better cooperation and listen to a smarter leader, regardless of what other strategies they decided to focus on.

    If we remove Big Mom pirates and Kaido, the alliance rape Beast Pirates. Fighting Kaido heads on and wait for everyone in the one place is stupid.
     
  14. Samehadaman

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    I don't remember when/where but I remember making a post developing pretty much this point, the plan seemed quite dumb.

    They had the surprise and Kaido/Orochi were the ones spread out occupying territory.

    Yet their plan amounts to "wait until they have assembled 100% of their military might and attack".
    Any normal fighting force would have been ambushing King alone, attacking Queen at the prison, luring henchmen through village raids (like when Page One and Hawkins showed up) to bushwack them with top fighters, etc. to isolate Kaido, or alternatively attack Kaido in an occasion they know he doesn't have literally every single fighter at his disposal right by his side.

    This Onigashima event is, based on information had at time of planning, quite possibly the single worst moment they could choose to attack.
     
  15. Great Potato

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    Where would they have found the time to do that? They spent the last few days organizing their forces, liberating the prison, finding the blueprints, crafting ships, training to be strong enough to face Kaido, and so forth. Not like the Flying 6 or Calamities were all just wandering around Wano to be picked off either, and Kanjuro being undercover at the time would have made such a scheme difficult to pull off regardless.
     
  16. Mariko

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    They're not warriors but pirates. Scabbards neither, just Oden cheerleaders. None never played war games, and none are strategists.

    Besides, attacking them all at once is indeed risky, but not more than trying to sneak kill commanders one by one. They put everything on the surprise effect. If they had managed to kill let's say King earlier, Kaidou would have learned it pretty quickly and wouldn't have let them organize.

    It's an all or nothing raid. They know pretty well that their chances to win are thin (except Luffy who just doesn't care).
     
  17. Amol

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    Current plan is dumb.
    Good guys allowed Kaido and Orochi to have all their forces at same place making things actually HARDER for them. A good military strategist tries to make things as advantageous for himself as much possible. The current strategy is literally the worst case scenario for good guys. Kaido has everyone and everything by his side. Good guys for whatever reason chose the day to attack him when he is at his Strongest. We know it was done because this is Shonen and Oda wanted to give everyone fights but logically plan is dumber than rock.
    And whole collecting fodders for war is pointless exercise. They don't actually matter. Law and Zoro has been in Wano for so long. So has been Kinemon. They didn't do much until Luffy arrived in Wano. Heck it was Luffy who actually gathered all Samurai instead of group which was sent ahead to do this exact job.
    They knew where Calamities live (Queen for example tends to be at Prison for example) and Jack's town was mentioned.
    Why not attack Queen when he is all by himself? They would have eliminated him. They could have taken his heart via Law's powers even if they were not going for kill. They could have manipulated him later on.
    Then there is Denjiro. He could have killed Orochi long long time ago. He is responsible for Orochi's security after all. Orochi literally trusted him to look after Wano in his absence. Just kill him and put blame on Witching Hour Boy or Mountain Bandit Ashura or Ghost of Oden or Erectile dysfunction etc. Then pledge loyalty to Kaido and be the next Orochi. If Denjiro was going to act as underling then he should have acted underling of a guy who actually is the real enemy. Why he pointlessly served Orochi for so many years is beyond me. Denjiro could have built a powerful and loyal Samurai army for himself. Instead he acted as dog of pathetic weakling and whored his master's Daughter. Worst guy to look and protect your daughter tbh tbf.
    Basically not a single good guy (starting from Oden himself) has used even fraction of brain while dealing with bad guys in Wano. All good guys ever do is Leeroy Jenkins at bad guys. This makes for good fights though so as long as Oda actually delivers on great fights, I won't mind obvious lack of brainpower here.
     
  18. Samehadaman

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    They don't have to start with King though, they can start with Kaido. Just not on the one occasion Kaido is guaranteed to have all his forces next to him.
     
  19. Lawliet

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    There can't be any different time.

    Let's assume the alliance had everything planned earlier and they could choose whenever they want (which is not the case because they literally just fixed everything from ships to manpower to everything), It can't be after the party because Kaidou plans to wipe everyone from the flower capital.

    Let's say they didn't know that which they didn't.. It simply couldn't be before the party. they just fixed everything. And, the raid can't be during normal days. The alliance wouldn't move an inch without people seeing them. And they wouldn't be able to keep Udon a secret for that long.
     
  20. Mariko

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    I could agree this. Cut the head first. But I guess their "plan" is to get rid off the entire BPs in one "all or nothing" raid.

    Once again, none are war strategists. Just pirates and some samurais who never known any actual wars. This isn't Kingdom.

    They just seized a chance to ambush them all thinking they had a small chance to win thanks to the surprise factor. Is that a good or bad strategy? Maybe not the smartest from a reader pov, but inverse ppl don't know what the readers know.
     
  21. Shiba D. Inu

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  22. Whimsy

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    They should have brought in Capone to plan the yonkou assassination, at least his plan factored in how to hurt the emperor and disable their backup
     
  23. Descent of the Lion

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    Except the Yonko, All-Stars, Headliners are all on top of one another.
     
  24. Vagrant Tom

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    No, the best course of action is to fight them all at once. This way the arc ends faster.
     
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