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Kabuto at Kakashi's level?

Discussion in 'Konoha Library Archives' started by Hamaru, Oct 14, 2006.

  1. The Truth

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    Kakashi was jounin level at 13/14. Kakashi was Kakashi's level at 28, Kabuto was Kakashi's level at 19. What is your point? Kabuto reached Kakashi's level of skill about 9 years earlier then Kakashi did. That is the very definition of faster progression
    Oro wanted to torture Sandaime by having him killed by his former teachers. The point being that Kakashi would have to prevent Kabuto from moving in order to land the MS on him. That tracking fang technique worked on Zabuza because he couldn't see it coming.
     
  2. Odlam

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    If the manga said it, it's most likely true. And this is coming from a big Kakashi fan.

    Kabuto is a resilient little tool, he has more up his sleeve than he is showing.

    Of course on the other hand, that was pre-mangekyo Kakashi. So the balance may have tipped over the timeskip.
     
  3. Khamzul

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    My thoughts:

    Pretimeskip: Kabuto=Kakashi

    Posttimeskip:
    Proof that Kabuto has improved:
    Proof that Kakashi has improved: Yes, he has aquired MS.

    Do I think Kabuto has improved - ofcourse, maybe even more than Kakashi.
    Does what I think make it a fact - no.

    I will think Kakashi is stronger then Kabuto until we see Kabuto fight again showing some new skills which weights up for the MS.
     
  4. Sexta Espada

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    It also stopped Zabuza from moving. If Kakashi couldn't get a shot at Kabuto, why not stop him with the Fanged Pursuit? He couldnt dodge it.

    And Kakashi's early progression was faster. We could compare their early years. Kabuto failed to become a Genin at the Academy test, whil Kakshi was a Chuuni at six. But of course, it would be too unfair, and you would argue very much against it.
     
  5. Odlam

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    A perfectly fair and logical assessment
     
  6. The Truth

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    Zabuza had the area covered in mist, he couldn't see it coming. Kabuto also has the abilty to underground, he can also mask his scent and heartbeat.
    We have no idea how fast Kabuto's progression was early on, he was spying in Konoha that was why he remained a genin. Also Kakashi's early progression means nothing because Kabuto has already reached Kakashi's level 9 years early.
     
  7. Sexta Espada

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    Wait, Kabuto has been a spy since he couldn't even compete with a Genin?
    He failed the Chuunin Exams in order to spy, not the Academy test.
     
  8. The Truth

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    My mistake i thought you were referring to the chuunin exam, the point still stand though.
     
  9. Sexta Espada

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    No, I meant when they were under 10. I thought I put it in my post. Oh well, doesn't matter much now.

    Kabuto was a Genin at 10, and Kakashi was a Genin at 5, Chuunin at 6. If we were to compare that, Kakashi would be much better than Kabuto. But it would be biased from the start, so we won't.
     
  10. The Truth

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    No it wouldn't because Kakashi currently is equal to Kabuto who is 9 years his junior. Meaning that despite Kakashi's rate of growth in his youth, he has either slowed down or Kabuto has sped up. Either way, whatever works.
     
  11. Sexta Espada

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    He slowed down. He got the aftereffects Obito's death, and bacame lazy and stopped training. But now he has precious people again, and has begun to train harder again.

    And how do you get Kabuto is equal to post time skip Kakashi? He can't compete with Akatsuki members, since they're about equal to 4 tails. And 3 tails pwnd him with one roar.

    Kakashi, on the other hand, out smarted the Itachi clone, and fought with Deidara for a bit, and might have won. He at the very least stopped Deidara's best attack.
     
  12. Tsunade

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    Kabuto's biggest egde has always been his regeneration and medical nin experience. This made him equal in level pre time skip for Kakashi because what Kabuto lacked in techniques and experience he could make up for with the medical edge.

    Post time skip, it's a toss up. We know Kakashi has grown, as he says himself, he is still young, he will continue to grow, he is still the master of techniques and Kabuto may be clever and manipulative, but Kakashi is the one with a brain 'like Shikamaru's'. Like Khamzul says, we know Kakashi has progressed quite a bit. We can ASSUME Kabuto has progressed as well, but we don't see that much from him (outside of KN4 swatting him like a fly despite Kabuto's having activated his medical chakra for attack..but after all that is KN4). In the meantime, Orochimaru will not have been training Kabuto that much, but rather focusing on Sasuke. Kabuto also will be having to work double time as Orochimaru's right hand man to keep their team in hiding, moving around, doing various crap for Orochimaru, basically being his tool. I don't think Kabuto has gotten to focus on his skills the way Kakashi has been able to in the time skip. He will still be formidable because of his regeneration and whatever survival techniques he's developed after 2.5 years of living with an emo Sasuke, but to say he is past Kakashi is presumptious. They're still balanced, at best, Kabuto is falling behind a bit at worst.
     
  13. The Truth

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    Great, whats your point? His progression slowed down perhaps but that has no bearing on Kabuto.
    I say their equal because i have no reason to beilieve otherwise.
    Kakashi has never shown he can compete with Akatsuki members nor the 3 tails.
    A 30% clone, and an a one armed Diedara who had just spent his time giving chakra for a bijuu extraction? No this portion of your post is wrong on many levels.
     
  14. Sexta Espada

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    Tell me one way Kabuto has to defeat an Akatsuki member, or even stand a chance.
     
  15. The Truth

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    I don't have to because Kakashi hasn't shown he can either.
     
  16. Sexta Espada

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    He came up with a plan that might have also worked on the real Itachi. And he stood up to Deidara, don't say bullshit. Deidara lost some chakra, but did he look at all tired to you when he fought with Kakashi?

    You just have no way for Kabuto to fight an Akatsuki, so you don't post any ways he could.
     
  17. clouded_fate

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    as much as i love kakashi(he losts all his friends and didn't become angsty) i say kabuto is stronger, by bit. kakashi was able to turn away rasengan and chidori becuase they didnt notice him,s o he easily came in on the side, while kabuto was suprised, and held in place when he got hit, and even, then, afterwards, in the find sasuke arc, he deflected rasengan easily.

    as for ability, his medical justu is every powerful, possily above tsunade. his medical jutsu is even deadlier then raikari, since he uses a tiny amount of chakra only, and it doesn't exactly stand out, so his medical jutsu can actually be concealed until in range.
     
  18. The Truth

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    You don't seem to get it do you? My lack of a response wasn't because i couldn't devise a way for Kabuto to do what Kakashi did. The point is that why should I speculate? Kakashi has never even fought equally with an Akatsuki memeber or someone of that stature. Its funny that you say i'm stating bullshit when you conviently ignore the facts. I'll clear it up for you:

    Diedara was not fighting Kakashi, he was fleeing.

    Kakashi never fought Itachi, he fought a 30% clone.

    Kakashi has faced opponents on the level of Akatsuki members twice. The first time Oro scared him off with a glance. The second time Itachi put him in a coma for a month.

    Kabuto on the other hand fought Tsunade...
     
  19. Myyahele

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    Kabuto is one as well. 7 Years younger and on par with a genius. Next off, he?s Oro number one guy, his main medic, and he uses medical jutsu in combat. He?d have to be somebody special for that. Even in his one fight he didn?t do to terribly much, some cutting and a summon, so he?s got more to show. He got hit full on by a jutsu that can rip a huge hole through a metal container and only fainted. (caught off guard). 2.5 years wouldn?t be enough for that guy to come up with a few new tricks? You?ve got to be out of your mind if you?d think that.

    Kakashi <= Kabuto.

    P.S for Kakashi to use M.S. he needs a good bit of time to charge it up. I?m certain he wouldn?t get a chance with someone who?s at least his equal.
     
  20. Sexta Espada

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    He got the chance with Deidara, who was quite a bit more powerful than him.
     
  21. The Truth

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    He didn't fight Diedara, he attacked Diedara. Recognize the differance.
     
  22. Sexta Espada

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    "I'll fight you again soon..."
    How can you do something again if you haven't done it before?
     
  23. The Truth

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    How do you know he wasn't referring to Naruto? He's the jinchurrikki, why would Diedara have any reason to fight Kakashi again?
     
  24. Sexta Espada

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    He said Naruto was of no threat, and Naruto is Itachi's jin. The only reason Deidara was after him was because he and Sasori were the only Akatsuki physically present. Otherwise, he would have no reason to go a round wanting to capture or fight him.

    Kakashi is a challenge however. And since it seems Deidara likes a challenge, he would logically go after Kakashi, if he ever saw him again.

    I'm going to sleep now, so we can continue this in the morning. It's late where I am, and I'm tired.
     
  25. Myyahele

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    You = Fail.



    He only launched a single attack, a one hit K.O. one at that. Caught him off guard, doesn't really count for what we're talking about. We're asking who's stronger, if either party is. Not who’d win with a one hit K.O. Shika < Temari, but who (almost) won the fight?

    He'd never get the chance to use that attack aginst Kabuto, in fact he only used it against Deidara because he had no other alternatives. So you're still fucking wrong.

    Naw, he was going to take 'em if he got the chance, that's why Sasori & Itachi were so pissed.

    Akatsuki don’t seem to have the privilege of getting to settle personal grudges whenever they wish, but collecting tailed demons, right up their ally. Sure he could have been talking to Kakashi, only due to the possibility of him having to fight to get to Naruto. Naruto who he’d see as a prize as he didn’t see him as much of a threat. So yea, that proved nothing. Oh, in addition, Deidara was out of ammo. He couldn’t fight back cept’ for that final clone.
     
  26. PDQ

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    I think that says enough.

    Even if she'd not been at her peak, for Kabuto to get to a point where he could say this:

    "It would be troublesome if you were to die now, so I won't aim for your neck"
    i.e. he was in a position to kill her.
    says a great deal about him.

    Deidara compared one aspect(dojutsu) of Kakashi as on par with Itachi, Tsunade admitted two aspects of Kabuto(senses and strength) were surpassed her own in her prime.

    Given that he grew at such a rate in his early years despite having to hide his power(as a spy of Orochimaru and of Sasori's), now that he had 3 years to work exclusively under Orochimaru, even moreso in the realm of enhancing growth at phenomenal rates, without having to hide his power, and with the advantage of youth on his side, it is very likely that like Myyahele said, Kabuto >= Kakashi.

    Oh, and most importantly of all, lets not forget Orochimaru's frequent remarks about Kabuto's intelligence, the fact that Kabuto's intelligence stat maxed out before Kakashi's, and the fact that the databook makes frequent comments about his intelligence as well.
     
  27. Myyahele

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    Didn't even realize that. He could have killed a sannin but chose not to. PDQ you fuckin' closed this thread. You = win.
     
  28. sexualrug

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    First off, kakashi had DECLINED and he was at whatever level he was before time skip. Unless there is some hidden relationship on the part of kabuto and someone else, I don't think kabuto will ever reach the level that kakashi will. Furthermore, being on someone's level doesn't mean you can defeat them in a fight.

    The angle kakashi had to use on deidara was very strange and from the panels we saw the distance was fairly large. Lastly, at least from the panels I recall, deidara was looking exactly at kakashi when the jutsu was happening.

    I think kabuto was on the level of kakashi just like say yamato is on the level of kakashi or kurenai is on the level of kakashi. I think from what we saw pre-skip kakashi could take kabuto out in a fight and after skip we haven't seen much from kabuto but from what we saw, I see no REASON to think the result would be any different if not even more in kakashi's favor.


    The skirmish between kakashi and kabuto had no conclusion, it was just kabuto escaping. That statement form kakashi could have meant several different things. Kakashi didn't know who else was working for oro, he just made a judgment call that if oro was commanding ninjas at the level of kabuto, he should get stronger (which in reality meant get back in shape at that point).
     
  29. KuwabaraTheMan

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    Exactly. I've been saying this for the past year, but everyone just goes "Nanananana not listening! Kakashi looks cool, he pwns 4 eyes."
     
  30. PDQ

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    That was the conclusion. He was showing off to Kakashi and even admitted that he did it just to see how they would react with that information. He even wanted Kakashi to know what he looked like by taking off his mask. Showing off to one of Konoha's greatest shinobi and talking back shows a sense of spit-in-his-face-superiority.

    He outwitted Kakashi completely. He had all the time in the world to kill Sasuke(I mean FFS, he did reconstructive surgery among other things in that time period), and rather waited for Kakashi to find him, knowing damn well that he had a 100% chance of escape that even Kakashi wouldn't stop.

    Even Itachi has shown more agitation with Kakashi's power than Kabuto.

    When Jiraiya and Orochimaru said he was the same level/had the same power as Kakashi, they weren't kidding, but if anything, they would've made conservative estimates and they could've realized that he was even greater or underestimated him as he has been hiding his strength his entire life.
     
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