Discussion in 'The NF Café' started by Masterblack06, Nov 7, 2019.
Just the US continuing to treat poverty stricken people like dirt... just like immigrants and their troops.
I mean, it can be a nuisance. Every weekend there are homeless people in the denver and slc area shouting and cussing and starting fights with each other. It sucks. It scares people. It gets in the way of businesses when they camp out front and scare off customers.
Even for bleeding hearts who can't stomach thinking of the homeless as a 'nuisance', there are usually programs these people could take advantage of but don't, or tried to take advantage of but got kicked out because they have more problems than just poverty. I'd also wager most of the homeless who sleep on sidewalks and streets are the ones that have more problems than just poverty because there are almost always more convenient and safer places available to spend your nights than on the sidewalk. Even when you're homeless.
But it's Las Vegas, what if you just pass out drunk on the side of a building?
I would almost agree with you, accept they seem to have a problem setting up places like that because people who live close to those places usually do not want the homeless nearby. So the places for they already have get filled up.
Even then, there are still places to go, never mind where you're supposed to be. There are places in and around cities where you can camp that are much safer than the sidewalk or the street out in the open. In most cases in most cities the majority of homeless people aren't even the ones camping out in the open like that. Those are the ones with real problems, that they just plop down on a sidewalk.
Police can be real assholes about this stuff though so hopefully nobody starts trolling around looking for bum quotas and giving desperate people an arrest record to deal with on top of being homeless. Vegas doesn't seem to have a chill police force. They're not phoenix arizona bad, but ehhhh
How many drunk people and people who lost all their money gambling do the same thing though?
Are you joking? They killed 2pac.
If you are against jailing people for not affording houses because they are a "nuisance" you are a "bleeding heart".
Your standard for civility keeps getting lower every time you post. It's like nothing is too atrocious or inhuman for you not to come here defend it with the same noncommital tone.
I agree with the principle of keeping the streets clean. However, they need to at the very least provide temporary shelters. Or allow co-ops to buy and build them for temporary housing. You can't ban something and not offer an alternative in these kinds of circumstances.
I heard they have areas designated to be shanty towns in Vegas. I don't imagine that's very flattering to tourist, or comfortable for locals living nearby. Still, I think it's preposterous to tell people they can't sleep on the street, benches, parks, and really any where that isn't private property, and or has no safety risk.
Why not just have specific jails meant only for the homeless where they can spend a day or two? No criminal record. No mixing with those charge or awaiting trial. This way, if the police "pick them up" under the new laws, they'll have so.ewhere to put them temporarily. I realize it sounds pretty cold, but it's better than real jail, no?
Then let me put it this way.
I was never sleeping on the street or sidewalk when I was homeless.
edit- and for people who always try to be mindful of compassion and compassion's an important part of your worldview, there's a bigger ecosystem here than just the homeless person. People get scared when there are fights and unstable behavior. Women don't feel as safe walking around even in the middle of the city, in the middle of the day. Sometimes these homeless are swearing, fighting, acting erratically, and people are uncomfortable with that, not with the fact of somebody having no home. I get not trusting police to handle this compassionately, but there is a larger ecosystem here than just the guy on the sidewalk. There are more places to show your compassion than just that guy.
That's very awesome that you didn't have to sleep on the street when you were homeless. It's clearly not the case for most of these people. I don't know your reasons for being homeless but (anecdotally) when I lived in Denver I saw a lot of veterans, some with missing limbs and I usually saw them gather behind a brick wall/sign.
A lot of the homeless are veterans:
A lot of the homeless are single mothers and children:
The ones who are getting into fights may have mental illness or substance abuse problems that have gone untreated. I don't see this issue being solved over night but I also don't think banning people with nothing and no where to go from sleeping on a sidewalk is not the right solution.
I've mentioned it before in passing, but I was homeless in my late teens and a bit in my very early 20s. Had a rough go early in life. I'm not going to start up a sob story, I just want to stress that even dire desperate circumstances don't leave you sleeping on a street or sidewalk like that. So much of the reality about homelessness isn't that and I think compassionate people are overstepping their understanding when imagining that anyone who has no home and no money just...sits down on sidewalks to sleep.
Like I had no resources, I wasn't couch surfing, not sleeping in a car (didn't have a car), I was sleeping outside on a tarp and I still never slept out in the open on a sidewalk or street like that. It's crazy dangerous, for one thing. If everybody in this thread suddenly became homeless tomorrow almost nobody would spend their first night lying down on a sidewalk sleeping out in the open.
Don't know that vegas police are the ones to deal with this, but for whatever it's worth, the homeless people we pass by on our day to day and go, "oh, there's a homeless guy" because we can tell just by looking - they're sitting on the sidewalk with a shopping cart and sleeping bag - those are often the minority of homeless people in the city. Not every city, and probably not homeless hotbeds like san fran or portland, but in a lot of cities those are the people having problems with drugs and mental health and alcoholism and other issues. I never looked like that, I never did that, and I never knew anybody else in my situation who looked like that or did that, and in my experience when most homeless people see those guys, they also steer clear of them.
If anyone thinks you become this just because you have no home and money,
miss me with that bullshit.
Homeless people can be a problem but this seems like counterproductive.
I know that not everybody is as smart as me but my incredible deductive abilities has told me that homeless people are homeless infact because they have no money. I know shocking but it is true. So making people pay for not having money is weird to say the least. Not to mention giving them criminal record which decreases their ability to get job substantially. So this move in my opinion does everything in its power to make sure those who don't have money will have even less money even in future. Seems obvious enough to me.
But like I said I can't expect everybody to be as smart as me.
Not every homeless person has absolutely no money. I'm sure @reiatsuflow had money when they were homeless, right?
Also homelessness isn't criminalized because being poor is criminalized, it's criminalized because our society isn't really set up for homelessness and a homeless person accidentally trips all sort of loitering laws, property laws, trespassing laws and other things designed to protect homes, businesses and neighborhoods. A homeless person also isn't being vetted by all the safeguards our society has in place to make sure a sex offender isn't rented an apartment next to a school, which is one of the reasons police snoop around homeless populations to check everybody out. Not just to be mean.
Like one of the first things you figure out if you're homeless is to never sleep anywhere near a school or anything like that because if you're caught it's going to be more of an issue; most of the time police aren't trying to bully you, they're trying to protect everybody else living around you and you're this outlier outside of social safeguards.
And homeless people are inherently suspicious because out society isn't set up to be homeless and tbf it takes some effort and dysfunction to get to the place where you're homeless in america and have no resources, whether money or people. It's easier for young people to end up in a bad way if there's home life problems and other things (when I said I was homeless in my late teens, I was younger than 18) and young people do make up most of the temporary homeless population, so hopefully police aren't assholes about that. Hopefully police would treat a kid differently than an adult and not give him an additional arrest record to fuck up his already iffy prospects. It depends on the police, really.
Would you take one in your home then? One less person on the street.
I live in Scotland. We provide homeless shelters and hostels so people don't sleep rough, like any developed nation should. Nice non-sequitur though.
Oh, and for the record, I work as a social worker and during my time in addictions have helped many homeless people obtain permanent residence and got several into rehabilitation, which is a two year tenancy. Not a boast.
Good shit my dude. I hope it's not too stressful on ya.
Cheers, but no praise necessary.
How is Scotland when it comes to illegal immigration?
It's not in control of immigration due to the way UK legislation operates, but welcomes everyone, because it's not backwards or believes in anti-immigration propaganda.
Muslim immigrant killed by an extremist muslim immigrant that was living in England.
What's your point?
Social and welfare systems are all good while there's money to support it,
Once the well start to run dry things tend to change quite rapidly.
Scots hate everyone as a default until you share a drink with them.
If you steal any of their booze, you're back on the bad list.
Unless you're a Scot.