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no need for religion

Discussion in 'Philosophical Forum' started by Freeks, Jun 24, 2005.

  1. Freeks

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    the history of the different religions are all the same: BLOODY.

    on the age of knights and kingdoms.the kristians whent out to "defeat" the barbarians. what do you think they did. KILLED... but religion doesent justifie Killing.

    but i think i know something. its the ones who interperate the different holy texst that makes the rules. and thats bad. they make the rules for their own winning... or whatever.


    one example: 9:11 and after. the reply of 9:11 whas no good either... killing... only killing

    in some holy texts, one main rule is: You shall not kill. BUT WTF. we humans are so stupid and would be beter of without religion



    GAAAH... im just talking rubish now. dont mind me. im just a cranky dude...
     
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  2. stomponfrogs

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    Umm.. I'm slightly religious, and I've never killed someone for not believing what I believe. I think I'm better off with a religion, actually. It seems like the entire basis of your argument is that religion makes people kill each other, which I completely disagree with. I think of wars as more of a result of humanity, not religion. Humans are going to fight each other for one reason or another, since there will always be close-minded disagreement. Religion is just one of the excuses that people make now. Without it, they would just find another one (excuse).
     
  3. Freeks

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    probably right. but i still think religion is the main-cause of human suffering
     
  4. stomponfrogs

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    Well, you could also say that quite a few people wouldn't be as content with their lives without religion. Sorry if I sound kinda arrogant in what I say. I know you are entitled to your opinion, regardless of whether I agree or not. I just wanted to try sharing my thoughts on it. It's all speculation after all, right?
     
  5. [I am teh Haruka]

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    If everyone tried to get others to stop believing in their faiths, things would go even more wrong than with religion. I know that in my religion (Islam) it says not to kill unless you're in war. And we shouldn't even be in war.

    The Muslims who kill for fun aren't even considered Muslims.

    But anyways, if people kill over religion, then they need to learn that the world is different and not everyone is the same.
     
  6. opium4themasses

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    I have perhaps a better explanation. War is fought over limited resources. We fight for land, for money, for oil, and freedom. Religion creates another resource, access to the higher plane/being. This new resource can be the reason for fighting.

    So if this is true, religion is not the only reason for war, but it doesn't help. (Also note I said reason not cause, the true cause has more to do with leaders willing to sacrifice their youth for a reason. This reason may or may not be a good reason)
     
  7. dont_look_back

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    all reliegions SAY peace
    all practicers practice war

    thats why im an atheist

    religion + another religion = war

    ps why am i takin r.e ???
     
  8. explicitkarma

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    Religion doesn't cause human suffering. Humans cause human suffering.
     
  9. skunkworks

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    It boils down to the unfortunately inherent greed, and malice humans possess. It's not necessarily religion that causes suffering, but the people who twist it for their own purpose.
     
  10. Chidoku

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    You can't really blame all religions. Yes, some religions approve of killing for a purpose, and maybe that's a huge part of our problems. Christianity, at least, doesn't approve of killing or any of that. The Bible, if you interpret it (IMO) correctly and use common sense, killing is wrong. Only in the most extreme cases may killing be approved of. However, all should be done to prevent killing unless it's for the greater good. I can't really think of a good example, but maybe take your average shootout movie. There's a criminal who has gone mad, won't be reasoned with, and kills many people. If you and him are alone in a room and he pulls a gun out on you, you have no choice but to shoot him first to prevent your death and many others.

    There's a lot to religion that's good. Even if I wonder whether or not there is a God, I'll hold true to my faith anyway. What's wrong with a church? I go to church and find many good people who are very friendly and make a great second family. I also find young children being raised from good teachings, and there's nothing wrong with that.
     
  11. Scorpio3.14

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    Religion has cause way more good in this world then any war over religion. People always seem to remember the crusades, or the many holy wars, but who brings up the thousands of years of churches taking care of the poor, runing homes for orphans, helping people at there worst of times. Its the every day stuff that religion does to bring good in the world. Im not saying that without religion there would not be any of this stuff, but religion is a big part of it. Religious people have done countless things to make this world a better place yet all people want to bring up is the fighting that happens every now and then from people who twist religion.
     
  12. Aldredian_Sahn

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    Religious wars are probably remembered more than the good stuff they produce because they are so outrageous, being far from the truth of that religion. The good stuff is what the religion does and isn't so absurd to catch people's eyes. The crusades were an event carried out by people in power that either completely misunderstood their religion or they used religion to get what they wanted.

    If everyone practiced their religions down to the bone, then there wouldn't be these bloody battles, at least Christianity, because the bible teaches tolerance towards everybody. So again, Christian blood baths are a result of
    A. Misunderstanding/Lack of Study
    B. Using it as a means for power/Not caring about the actual religion.​
     
  13. [I am teh Haruka]

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    People twist their religion around and use it a reason for war.
     
  14. Keramachi

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    Exactly. Just people kill for a religion, it does not mean the murder is condoned by that religion. That's why people should stop bashing Islam. The religion does not support killing in any way, shape, or form. As a Christian, I cannot explain it in detail, so you should ask moe instead, in this thread.
     
  15. sasukecopyninja

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    if we didnt have religion we'd create it, religion si a way for keep society organized and in a sense ina nd out of control lol
     
  16. zionforsell

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    I think we all ignore the fact that we are humans.

    Religion is a neutral thing. It does not bite anyone. But human beings are not perfect. We used it as a reason, a course, a tool,... whatever and hurt other human beings. The program has no flaws, if there is flaw, it lays in human! That is why we cannot trust religion. Because it was written by human! How can one or ten persons claim what they think is right then apply those rules to others??? I don't think so.
     
  17. jkingler

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    That is the conclusion I have come to, as well.

    I used to blame religion for all the woes of the world, because I am not at all religious and the world's various faiths, taken as a whole, seemed a likely scapegoat.

    But, after getting out of my angsty teenage days I realized that religion in and of iteself is not a catalyst for war. Most of the world's religions teach peace, and yet people who wilfully misread holy texts use decontextualized excerpts as excuses for warmongering. The leaders/governments/people go to war--religion is incapable of starting wars by itself.

    There are bad people of all denominations, and bad people of no denomination. The same goes for good people. While religion is the banner many a war was fought under, religion is not the cause. If you look deeper and really read the histories, there were other factors, such as land, money, bad blood, and ego. Look at recent history: wars are still waged and religion is not necessary. There are other origins of enmity, such as communism, oil, etc. Religion is merely one of many things people can choose to disagree on.

    To say religion is at fault for bloodshed and war is as ignorant a thing as a person can say. Not stupid--ignorant, as in misguided and misinformed. Read more, study history, and listen to both sides to get past your initial assumptions. Religion, like any other tool, can be used for good or for ill, but, in and of itself, as the person above said, it is neutral. I only wish I knew it sooner.
     
  18. Killenator

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    Religion isn't really the problem, because it isn't real, it's just humanities excuse. The problem is that people have a tribal mindset with an "Us" and a "them" and that means that they create things like religion to have more "us"'s and more "Them"'s.
     
  19. Jedi Mind Tricks

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    It's not religion that causes suffering, it's the people that are twisting the meaning of religion for their own selfish reasons; whether it be for money or power.

    If you look at the the vast majority of those situation, thats what it boils down to.
     
  20. Solemn_Thinker

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    Religion is necessary for some people. It helps them make sense of the world that they live in, and gives them guidelines for their lives. Like others said before, while wars may be raged in the name of religion, religion rarely is the main reason. It's those who twist the concepts and ideals of a religion for their own good.
     
  21. CrazyMoronX

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    If a christian is going around killing people because they are not christians as well, then they are obviously not very good christians... A few bad apples and the entire religious wolrd is stained forever I guess...

    But I agree, the world doesn't need religion in the classical sense. It boils down to a relationship and belief in God/Jesus that ultimately leads you to heaven, and religion does nothing for you but keep you occupied. But that's only in one aspect of chrsitianity, or what the world marks as christianity.
     
  22. mushi

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    that makes the most sense o_O..

    people dont go to war because of religion.. they go to war because they want to :blink its also nature.. to fight over land, and stuff.

    in relation to the topics title... we do need religion, if we didn't have it billions of people would live life without hope or ambition knowing they will only be saved by people who kill them
     
  23. Killenator

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    Like I said before. Religion is not good or bad. Religion is nuetral. However a few bad people tend to use religion to control others so it has become bad. Religion is good when good people create it and bad when bad people create it and manipulate it.

    Religion is just phillosophy, it has no more basis in causing good or evil than does reading Nietzche. People have turned it to evil, and perhaps for that reason it can never again be a good thing, but don't credit it with a reality it doesn't have. Religion is just what people put into a few empty words. Religion is not evil. Today's religions are controlled by the evil.
     
  24. yo586

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    religion is not neutral. There are some religions that are much more easily exploited to cause their brainwashed individuals to believe others should be killed.

    You will never see a devout Buddhist call in the name of his religion, but you are gonna see plenty of Jews, Christians, Muslims do it. There is just more of a suggestion towards that.
     
  25. Killenator

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    I was speaking about the idea of religion as a whole. Individual religions are not the same.
     
  26. Heldensheld

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    MAybe it's God's test on us humans?
     
  27. zeoblade

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    To kill or not to kill is the question and creativity in one's reason will affect if you need to kill or not. The reason for war is peace and neither component can live without the other. However I am a pacificist, as extremely violent I can be, I choose non-violence in the end. If it can be done without death then that is the way we must choose. Don't try to justifify a reason to kill because either you are too weak or too lazy.
     
  28. Twizted

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    Let me say this. There is no need for organized religion. I think that everyone should believe in something, be it Jesus, Allah, or the Sun. Whats important is that everyone have faith in something. That being said, I think that everyone should individually find that something on their own, and not told what to believe by some guy in a white robe 10,000 miles away. ;)
     
  29. meekozy

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    But you have to think, most athieset(sp?) don't believe in god and don't have someone to limit their capability, so if there is no religion, everyone are atiesets and the world would go to hell
     
  30. nirvanainanutshell

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    i am not saying the religion is wrong but i am recently athiest and life hasnt changed for me accept my freinds tell me to beleive in god.
     
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