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Not all Akatsuki are uber strong

Discussion in 'Konoha Library Archives' started by Sorrow-Tear's Champion, Jun 3, 2007.

  1. Sorrow-Tear's Champion

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    With all the discussion of Sasuke vs. Deidara it got me to thinking. Not everyone in Akatsuki is an overly powerful ninja. Some of them just have a powerful gimmick jutsu that makes them useful.

    Hidan is one. He had no fighting skills whatsoever. But his immortality is something that would come in very handy in a fight.

    Tobi was just Zetsu's flunky. The only reason he got in was because a spot opened up. but it's not clear what his skills are, so he could turn out stronger or weaker than we think.

    Zetsu has excellent tracking and scouting abilities. But that says nothing of his fighting skills. I can't make a judgment on him, but we do know what his use is.

    Sasori was another gimmick jutsu user. I'll admit I have an extreme bias against puppet users. In my opinion, no matter how skilled they are with puppets, they suck. But for people trying to take over the world, an army of puppets could further that goal greatly.

    Kisame, Itachi and Kakuzu have shown they were among the strongest ninja in the manga. Kisame may be the most physically dominate ninja ever. Itachi may be the most skilled ever. And Kakuzu took elemental jutsu's to a new level.

    Blue hair and the AL haven't been shown yet so they don't count.

    Which brings me to Deidara. If not for Hidan, he would be the biggest gimmick in Akatsuki. He makes bombs, that's it. There's really nothing else to speak of. Yes it helps further Akatsuki's goals. But that doesn't make him very strong. He beat Gaara, who's attention was distracted trying to protect his village. He didn't outfight or overpower Gaara. He used a cheap trick, which is perfectly alright. Doesn't make him very strong. He beat the Sanbi with the help of Tobi, a bijuu that couldn't direct it's power properly since it was mindless. If I shoot a bear with a gun and he dies or falls, I beat the bear. Doesn't say I'm stronger than the bear. And that's what Deidara's jutsu is like. Shooting a gun. Takes skill to use well, but has nothing to do with strength.

    So people shouldn't be surprised or quick to say PNJ if Sasuke beats Deidara. Just because he's in Akatsuki means fuck all when it comes to power. It just means he has something they find useful.
     
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  2. TheFlameAlchemist

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    Deidara is uber strong, trickery is one of the most important tactics for Shinobi, and it wasn't cheap it was smart thinking, he was hoping that Gaara was a sucker when it comes to his village, and he got trap.
    Don't get me wrong, I'd do the same thing Gaara did.
     
  3. InfIchi

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    ZoMg Juu r Nuub Akaski r KaGe LElvle!

    hehe. anyways yeah they really are not all uber gods.
     
  4. Nakiro

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    Akatsuki are Shinobi just like everyone else, nothing gives them the "God Mode". Most of them are going to die anyways.
     
  5. Mek Blaze

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    Did you forget that intelligence plays a role? Deidy would be long dead if was just randomly throwing bombs. I'm assuming by strong you only mean physical strength.
     
  6. anime4life

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  7. Kusogitsune

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    Hidan was uberstrong, he just forgot to use the skulloslider.
     
  8. Kenpachi_Uchiha

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    It's not that their all uber strong but that their highly dangerous opponents. You don't know kakazu and hidan's abilities then you are dead on the spot most likel same with sasori. Those three had sick specialties that you would find a hard picking out a shinobi that can kill them with no knowledge of their abilities. Being uber strong does not equal uber dangerous.
     
  9. ez

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    a characters jutsus = a characters strength

    it's as simple as that. And Deidra's techniques would own anyone if they hit directly
     
  10. Noble Avenger

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    Itachi, Oro, and the Leader are all Kage level.

    Sasori is damn impressive as well. He passes the uber-test as well.

    Deidara defeated Gaara on his home turn, I'll barely pass him as uber strong.

    Hidan? Failz

    Kakuzu? Which one? The one that was fighting Kakashi? Barely passes. The one that fought Naruto? Failz

    I think Tobi will fail to be uber strong as well. He was Zetsu's apprentice, and Zetsu doesn't strike me as an overbearing fighter.

    Hopefully BH joins the uber-strong category though.
     
  11. fe10

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    So far is 4 or more against then.
     
  12. Kenpachi_Uchiha

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    Hidan fails because kishi made him fail.
    kakuzu, the guy who was raping kakashi and this close to taking his heart.

    Tobi- the majin buu of Ak. don't let the goodfyness fool you.
     
  13. The Fool

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    Until Akatsuki actually win a battle of substance, then I support the OP's theory. They just can't win at anything at all so far.
     
  14. Nedeti

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    Gaara had all the sand he needed yet dei still got him and he said him self it was hard not killing him so he was going easy...

    Of couse none of them are uber strong, i would say they are uber skilled at what they do best. The only character that we can all agree being uber strong would be Oroshimaru, fought against jiraiya and tsunade without using any nin-jutsu "summon kabuto took care of that for him." he also fought Naruto at KB form with 4 tails and survived pretty well and yet after showing such amazing skills and strengh he died at the hands of Sasuke witch i personnaly find darn stupid.

    So basicly strengh and skills are 2 diffrent things, and not to say some opponents no matter how strong you are can be your end. Hidan vs shikamaru, not only shika had seen/study how hidan's works he was the only one that could defeat him 1on1.

    Kakuzu's faith seem quite stupid, i think kishi didn't feel like keeping him. When he was fighting against kakashi, he was smarter and then with Naruto he was nothing but a stupid shinobi with elements to me.

    Sasori was good but shiyo old suna lady was the best oppenent he could face. Other than that sakura a mini tsunade that packs an elephant punch was there for support in both direct hits and meds. He had no chances.

    making it short, Tsunade uber strong and Oro uber skilled.
    Naruto uber strong and Sasuke uber skilled.
    In the naruto universe skill beats strengh and skill have ruse, trickery and bullshit with it.
     
  15. Yakushi Kabuto

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    I'm inclined towards beliving Hidan's moves are better than most believe because although not knowing his ability is a huge pitfall and is almost assures doom for his opponent, he has to manage to get in a hit somehow versus his opponents or he could just have his arm ripped off and that would be annoying what with having to get it back so he could even swing at people.
     
  16. King Scoop

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    They are all strong, but just in different areas.
     
  17. chebmanji

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    Sorrow-Tear's Champion. Not bad on what youre saying I agree and disagree on some parts. Don't get me wrong I'm not a big Deidara fan he gots skills still bomb boy? You take away his hands he has nothing he depends on those claims to no end I wana see what else he is capable of. Tobi hmmm besides acting like a foolish child I wana see whats he's got. Kisame,Itachi and Kakuzu are indeed the strongest in that Organization. Skill and strength? True both are different and needed. Some of Akatuski either have one or both. Kisame and Itachi and Orochimaru in my opinion have both. Puppet jutsu takes alot of skill true some lack strength but there skill manage to take there opponets apart. I could care less for Hidan that immortal once you blow him apart his done for so I say Hidan relied on Skill yet it wasnt enough against a genius
     
  18. Odlam

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    They are all very strong, just there are degrees of strength

    I don't think Deidara for example is on any higher of a level than Kakashi is, but Kakashi is strong enough that in Konoha, only the Jiraiya and Tsunade are superior to himself at this point in time. He's a beast of a beast.

    There is no height to an Akatsuki member's potential power, but there is a base. They do at least have to be strong enough to pass their membership examination, which we have yet to find out more about.
     
  19. Nakiro

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    Hidan was not able to attack like he usually does, since the rope to his scythe was blown up. We've seen how versatile he was in his first fight while the rope was attached.
     
  20. jhin22

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    they are all strong in different ways..
     
  21. mystictrunks

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  22. Kwheeler

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    Whats funny is that they were never portrayed as gods in either the manga or the anime. Thier godlike image was created by fans, the same fans who created the godlike images of Orochimaru(look how that tirned out) said Kabuto's old blood meant something, and also refer to Sasuke as Jesus. The fans are more dangerous to Kishi's vision than critics.
     
  23. Sho

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    I do see your point, Sorrow's Tear, however I think it really doesn't matter what your "gimmick" is as long as it allows you to fight other high level ninja evenly. If the only thing Deidara could do was use bombs yet he could fight evenly against other high level ninja- regardless of whether they were "all-rounders" or not- then I think he should be considered on that high level tier.

    However, if a character only relies on one gimmick to win, and it doesn't even put him on a high level compared to others (meaning that the gimmick only works against one specific fighting style for example) then that would definitely apply.

    I do agree that Akatsuki levels vary wildly. For some reason, people got into their heads that all Akatsuki would be at around Orochimaru's or Itachi's level when that's not the case. To caution against opposite reasoning however, I do believe that "Kage Level" is quite broad and that the Akatsuki individually can be considered "Kage Level". Of course there's a difference between Sarutobi Prime and Yondaime Kazekage level though, and so should be likewise with Akatsuki.

    Still, I can't really see many of the strong characters considered "ungimmicky" and that includes the Sannin, with the exception of Orochimaru. Orochimaru's proved that he's an all-rounder and that he is generally high in all attributes. The same can't be said of his former teammates, nor of anyone much else, so I'm baffled as to why people consider them more "impressive" than the Akatsuki we've seen so far when we really haven't seen the other Sannin live up to their hype.
     
  24. Sorrow-Tear's Champion

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    I never said they weren't skilled or dangerous. There's a reason they are in Akatsuki. Just like Shikamaru isn't strong, but he is dangerous to fight against. but it seems people are putting them as the be all end all because they are Akatsuki. I my self was fooled into believing that since Akatsuki was introduced. That's what led to my disappointment when we saw their performance. But after reading so much of how it's bad story telling if Sasuke beats Deidara and Tobi because they are Akatsuki, I rethought it.

    There's a reason Shikamaru was able to beat Hidan so easily. Hidan was not only stupid and overconfident, he was an average fighter. But he had a very dangerous jutsu if he hits you with it, you're done for. but that doesn't make someone strong. Deidara also has a dangerous jutsu. But outside of his bombs, he brings less to a fight than Naruto imo. He may be second tier like Kakashi and Kabuto and Yamato. But he's nowhere near guys like Jiraiya, Itachi, Orochimaru, Sandaime, Yondaime, Kisame and Tsunade. Those guys are strong in a variety of areas. Deidara's bombs are a powerful jutsu. But they make him seem stronger than what he is. You get passed them, that's his ass.
     
  25. chebmanji

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    Hmmm True if Hidan had that rope it could prove more useful like Ichigo usess his Zanpakto. Dont get me wrong got nothing against Hidan but he wasnt the best fighter mostly he relied on his immortality to finish off his oppents which is a good tactic. He had skills yet lacked physical strength and further tactics when he came against Shikamaru.
     
  26. AbnormallyNormal

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    what you call a powerful gimmick jutsu = uber strong, its sort of like the distribution of power is not the same as ovreall level of power. you can be awesome in taijutsu but suck at genjutus and still kick the ass of a fairly decent genjutsu and taijutus user you hear?
     
  27. vagnard

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    For me all Akatsuki members are Kage level except Hidan in a neutral battle that doesn't involve PIS.

    -Deidara defeated Kazekage in his hometurf and he wasn't even prepared...and he couldn't kill him.

    -Sasori took down a country by himself....overpowered Chiyo who was the equivalent of a sannin in Suna and defeated Sandaime Kazekage and turn him in one of his puppets.

    -Kakuzu defeated easily Kakashi when he becomes serious. He fought Shodai long time ago (so we can guess he become stronger after that match). He was easily kage level in my opinion.

    -30% Kisame was enough to overpower the second strongest jounin in Konoha. Gai needed 6 gates to defeat his 30% form. I'd say he is stronger than Tsunade from what we have seen.

    -Itachi defeated Orochimaru (a sannin) when he was 11. At 13 defeated the strongest clan in Konoha. Definitively Kage level.

    We don't know about Zetsu and Blue Hair. AL will be beyond Kage level and probably the strongest nin until the date.

    So...in my opinion Deidara is kage level. The reason he will lose against Sasuke is because the little Uchiha is kage level too already. It won't be plot no jutsu....but the most simple reason of all....Sasuke will be stronger.

    I'd put base Sasuke as low kage level (Deidara) and CS 2 Sasuke as mid-high Kage Level

    When people say "Kage level" all guys inmediately think in Sandaime Prime and Yondaime....they were unique.....Gaara and Tsunade are probably a good example of an average kage.
     
  28. joeshabadoo

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    You are an idiot. All akatsuki members are uber strong. Deidara can make homing bombs and shoot them from long range and defeated a kage. You act like making super strong homing bombs is somehow not insanely powerful. You don't like puppet users because you probably had a stroke and forgot how awesome they have consistently been. (Sasori defeated yet another even stronger kage) Even Hidan was absolutely overpowering with taijutsu and then he had immortality and instant kill jutsu. The guy was beaten by someone who could simply make him walk over a pit and into a trap with another uberjutsu, something no other close combat fighter could have avoided either.
     
  29. ~ Son of SPARDA ~

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    Judging from Hidan and Kakuzu's fight with the Konoha Chuunin I'd say the main point of this thread has already become apparent.
     
  30. AbnormallyNormal

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    however it isnt fair to call shikamaru a mere chuunin he is much better than that name indicates, plus he had preptime and the location of his fight was on his family's ceremonial grounds, and also he was extremely emotionally motivated UNLIKE almost always for him, so a lot of factors combined vs hidan.
    and obviously kakashi isnt a chuunin, nor is yamato or naruto. in fact the genuine chuunins there, ino, chouji, sakura, sai, didnt even participate in the battle.
     
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