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Rap vs. (c)Rap (Let's Debate)

Discussion in 'Music Department' started by delirium, May 27, 2007.

  1. delirium thyme

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    A majority of posts in the "Worst Rapper Thread" became about it's negative influence on the culture and the underground community arguing that not all Hip Hop is as such. So.. I'm moving those posts here so we don't hi jack that person's thread and we can keep this going. Like I said in the other thread, keep the flames to a non existent form.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2007
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  2. Kduff Kaizan

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    You spelled yawn wrong, and you're using a tired cliche (step your game up? Who says that anymore?) to try and insult me. I think you're in need of some originality, and definitely some intelligence.

    Good try though, kid.
     
  3. Jedi Mind Tricks <font face='Palatino Linotype, Arial'><font size='

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    Yeah, because grammar and intelligence are synonymous, oh wait…


    I'd take his advice mate. Go into the intelligent hip-hop thread right here, and request something for a newcomer.

    If you like it, you can take another shot at the poll. If not, at least you can say you gave it a shot.

    Or you can be an idiot, not give it ago and assume that everything mainstream is all hip-hop has to offer.

    Your choice, kid.
     
  4. Kduff Kaizan

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    Yeah, I've listened to rap, and I don't need to go into that thread, because I've already been there before. It was a joke, stop taking it so personally.

    And I'm of the notion that African Americans (or Blacks, whatever you prefer) are much more talented than what is in rap anyway. I don't think I need to reference such geniuses as Charlie Parker, Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davis, and so on and so forth to prove that point. What they did pushed the boundaries of people's imaginations and their perceptions of blacks, and all rap does is bring everyone's opinions of them down. Most rap is just insulting to what they did. Oh, and I know all about rap that is supposedly "briliant," seeing as my two closest friends are huge fans of it, and it still doesn't come off as anything special. So don't lecture me, bud, I tried it. I'm allowed to make stupid jokes if I want.

    So there ya go, child.
     
  5. Bender Bite my shiny metal ass!

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    One: Shut the fuck up.

    Two: Tupac crushes geniues like C.Park Dizzy.G and M.Davis Rap shows our view of culture the more streetwise side of the Black community and how life is for some of us is quite interesting.

    Three: It is not insulting some rap references it and shows the importance of it or pays tribute to them.

    Four: Shut the fuck GTFO

    So there "you" go child

    P.S Try not to be superior if you're going to use slang like "ya" retard....bitch.
     
  6. ~Shin~ Spectacular Insanity

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    I really don't understand people like you kduff. You first come in here and make a remark about rap when this thread is rap related. If you don't like rap then why post in a rap related thread? You're basically asking for trouble.
     
  7. Lord Yu Active Member

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    Someone needs some Busdriver stat!
     
  8. Kduff Kaizan

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    Wow, you're pretty stupid if you really think rap is better for Blacks than what those artists I mentioned were. Rap, in general, has done nothing but lower people's expectations of the black race, made a lot of the people who listen to it unintelligent thugs (look at most of the rappers and their criminal records if you don't believe me), and promoted the stupidity and ignorance that runs rampant in a lot of today's children. Do you ever fucking think Charlie Parker and Miles Davis would have a feud and shoot each other like the stupid rappers in the early to mid 90's did? Fuck no. They weren't fucking idiots. Yeah, some of them were huge addicts (Parker died at only age 30 of an overdose) but they weren't going around representing black culture as a bunch of uneducated idiots who did nothing but cuss and talk about their misdeeds.

    What rap has done for music is nothing when compared to what the artists I mentioned did for it. If America is remembered for anything we gave to the world, it will be jazz. And what those artists did for the black race. I don't care if I'm generalizing just "popular rap and hip hop," but I hate to tell you guys that most people who like rap listen to the popular shit, not the intelligent, often uplifting work some of the better artists have done.

    Oh, and as for saying "ya," I was being condescending, dumbfuck. Mimicking to make fun of. Ya know.

    It was a joooooke. If it was another subject, like which American Idol singer is the worst, I would have said the same damn thing.
     
  9. Jedi Mind Tricks <font face='Palatino Linotype, Arial'><font size='

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    I love the smell of double standards on an anime forum! :wink

    Anyway…

    That's all you had to say. :thumbs


    Oh snap! Fuck me, how long did that one take? Wait, I can do this too.
    Shall I call you a foetus now? Sperm maybe?

    The possibilities are endless!
     
  10. Kduff Kaizan

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    This pretty much shows exactly what I'm talking about. Most people who don't listen to rap think this about rap. And about the artists and people who listen to it. It wasn't like that with Jazz and Blues and Funk musicians. A lot of people at the time treated it the same as rock and roll, but it also showed many people that blacks aren't second-rate people who can't do anything as good as white people. And the artists I mentioned didn't go around promoting violence and stupidity like many of the popular rap and hip-hop artists do today. They just played fucking music. Their music wasn't about drugs and bitches and crime and how shitty their life was in the ghetto.

    I'm still waiting for someone to tell me how the artists I mentioned are no different from rap artists. Guess what? They are. They're totally fucking different.
     
  11. Batman M.I.S.

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    There Fixed!
     
  12. Bender Bite my shiny metal ass!

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    Have you ever heard of parents? Of course you haven't you fat ignorant pig.


    We all have parents that love us and are s'pose do whatever it takes to protect us from what could hurt us or potential ruin our lives. Explain things to us the rights and wrongs of music. And from as long as I,ve been around the block rap has not fucked the community up. If you,ve seen people like Bow Wow then you'd know that he is NOT and unintelligent thug or gangster. Then again Bow Wow sucks. Also if you think Blacks ruin rap then listen to Talib Kweli, MOS-Def, DMX Rakim and some Tupac. Alot of this generations music artist have taken interest into him and understand rap ain't shit without him and thus are trying to learn to make music as great as it was back then.

    Also my ignorant friend rappers do not purposely get themselves into that situation when they are involved in a beef or to the point they get criminal records. Rappers like do what they do to get famous or survive and sometimes make bad choices.

    I don't know what you're listening to or who you are talking about hardly rappers in it a feud like unless they're idiots liek 50 Cent and some other N*ggas trying to start shit with people. But that shit is rare and hardly ever happens. And gang shootings and happened way back and was NOT just started by the rappers. Plus, some of those had meaning and I do agree degrade Hip-Hop. However, that does not mean Talib-Kweli or them other dudes do that. Besides that's what happened when people get jealous of you.



    You are an fool.. an ABSOLUTE FOOL.

    Listen to fucking Rakim man, listen to MOS-DEF you are listening to the wrong fucking shit. I agree tho Jazz has done something for the world but still man there are some people who have actually sent a good message. Tupac has spoken of life and ghetto and the downsides of it NOT to mention man hardships and life for women.

    For instance, this ^ (use bro) here:

    [YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjprrWfR04k[/YOUTUBE]


    I hate condescendence and I hate white lazy motherfuckers or wannabe ^ (use bro) that come in talking about shit they don't understand and degrading my beautiful black race to shit because they don't like it.

    Now get the fuck out before I report your sorry ass.

    You're not even worth me continuing to argue with since anything you speak of hardly has logic embedded in it.
     
  13. Kduff Kaizan

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    There, (COMMA) fixed!
     
  14. delirium thyme

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    I love a good discussion and debate. But please, let's keep the flames out of it. You can be passionate, but you don't have to put another person's character down to show it no matter how correct you think you are. M'kay?

    I'll add my 2 cents once I've seen the flames have died down. If they don't, then I'll simply trash the thread.
     
  15. Kduff Kaizan

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    Logic? So the fact that some white guy calls a bunch of girls on a basketball team a bunch of "nappy-headed hos" and the entire country is up in arms asking if rap is to blame isn't a huge sign that people who don't listen to rap think negatively of the people who do? Rap, and most (MOST) of the artists who perform it have taken the image of the black race in America back to the fucking stone age. And a lot of Blacks act like the stereotypes that rap has created. And then they blame it all on the whites, when it's half their fault for giving into the fucking stereotype.

    Believe it or not, I'm not a fucking racist, and saying I don't like rap doesn't make me one. And you seem to be implying that it does. I agree that the black race in America has enough problems because of bigoted, racist bastards, but rap, and the image it is giving blacks, does not fucking help at all. And I know all about Shakur and most of the others, but guess what man, most of the people in America listen to the popular stuff like 50 Cent and whatnot, and watched the rap artists in the 90's feud over some stupid fucking "East Coast-West Coast" bullshit, and none of it has ever helped convince the racist bigots (and even the people that aren't racist) that Blacks AREN'T what rap makes them out to be.

    In my mind, a lot of the biggest musical geniuses of the last century were black, and because of the racism and bigotry that they grew up with they were able to rise above it all and make some of the most amazing, beautiful music the world has ever seen. But rap artists do the exact opposite, for the most part. They accept the stereotypes, and they use those to sell their albums. They fight, do drugs, and promote the sexualization of women all in the name of entertainment. And whether a few of the more obscure artists rise above it, popular rap is all about the negative aspects of what rap can be. And popular rap, not the indie (or whatever you like to call it) affects the overall image of the black man moreso than the obscure stuff.

    I do not enjoy rap. I don't like how it sounds. But I only dislike it because of the negative influence most of it has on our culture. When I walk into my living room and find my extremely white, extremely cracker sister listening to some Kelis song with the lyrics:
    "You give me your number, I call you up
    you act like ur pussy dont interrupt
    I don't have no problem with you fucking me
    But I have a little problem wit you not fucking me"

    or 50 Cent signing
    "I don't need Dom Perignon, I don't need Cris
    Tanqueray and Alize, I don't need shit
    ^ (use bro) I'm high all the time, I smoke that good shit
    I stay high all the time, man I'm on some hood shit"

    What the fuck do you want me to think about rap and hip-hop? This is the shit that permeates most of the population. You think this shit is of the same caliber as Charlie Parker playing "Bird Gets the Worm," or "Crazeology?" Even if you don't like Jazz, this popular shit everyone listens to is trash, especially compared to what other black musicians have done.

    There is good rap, I don't deny that. However, I won't say I enjoy it. I will say however that good rap is NOT what most people who like rap listens to. If it was, it would be on top of the charts, and not this other shit.

    Oh, and just so you know this isn't just my view on rap, I also can't stand most modern rock. Or Pop. Or most anything else that comes out today. Fallout Boy? My Chemical Romance? Greenday? Kelly Clarkson? American Idol? They are all trash, and they are worse than garbage when you compare them to the amazing rock and other various forms of music that was done in the past, and even by a few very limited artists of today.
     
  16. Purple haze Hoodz come in dozens

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    Kduff, you made some awesome points.

    But... I listen to some rap songs that contain guns, the demeaning of woman and talks of selling drugs and the talk of street life with what the thugs of real life have to deal with. I know I shouldn't like it but the main reason I enjoy listening to that shit is probably the same reason why I love to watch the godfather, Scarface and other violent gangster movies. I'm just fascinated on how they live.

    Fiction or not. The gangster/Flashy life style has been popular since the dawn of time.
     
  17. Zephos Banned

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    So rap is teh bad because of unfair stigma stemming from certain mainstream trends and acts in its whole?

    You might as well agree with the racist assumptions if your going to yell at rap rather than the assumptiors.

    As for Jazz and Blues, people saw it as "evil darky music", as soon as it went crossover (early rock) it was reviled as hell.
     
  18. Bender Bite my shiny metal ass!

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    Please Zephos and P.Haze don't try and debate with that fool It's obvious he has no idea what the hell is talking about. I'm sorry. Looking at his points they're no good to me. "Rappers only care about shooting each other?" :huh Saying they're responsible for the corruption of youth is pure bullshit.
     
  19. Kduff Kaizan

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    Yeah I know, you can't argue with facts and logic, so just give up. When people start resorting to what you just did it means they know they're wrong but won't admit it because they are childish.

    And when did I say "rappers only care about shooting each other." You're apparently illiterate and didn't understand a word I said.

    All of my points are valid, and for the most part, unbiased. Oh, and just so you know, you're entirely right about parents being most of the problem with today's youth, but any form of unmitigated violent or sexual material can affect children and teenagers adversely. And seeing as rap and hip-hop is what's popular now, and most of it is nothing but derogatory and sexist, it definitely doesn't help.

    Rap is, in a way, much like Rock and Roll in the way that it's what's new and it scares people. However, most of the uprising against rock and roll was because or small-minded Christian conservatives who had their heads up their asses. Rap just crosses a new line, no holds barred, and is offensive to even someone as liberal as me. There is a difference. And I'm tired of hearing this analogy. Rock and Roll wasn't perfect, and it definitely encouraged some bad values in some kids, but it wasn't about fucking and shooting and killing and everything popular music nowadays blatantly talks about.

    Also, and this is just a theory, but I'm pretty sure popular Rap is just a fad, for most people. Just like the Pop era a few years back with Britney Spears and the Backstreet Boys and the like. And guess what? Almost no one listens to that shit anymore, almost everyone thinks it's terrible, and luckily that shit has gone the way of the do-do.

    And just so you fucking know, there's quite a difference between a single simple sentence and a paragraph when it concerns misspelled words. Seeing as I don't spell-check a single thing I write, I think I'm doing pretty damn good.
     
  20. Bender Bite my shiny metal ass!

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    Uh-huh keep thinking that way. Nothing but bullshit and biased oppinion is read all over your post. Wit no signifcant evidence. Oh, and listening to a single rap album is not bad. Also rappers are not sexist either. Although they appear as ignorant as you see them in the music videos and lyrics outside of their rap lives they talk like any normal person and about the same as you and me.
     
  21. Cal Hate those noodle wonka forks.

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    actually no, its no different
    they = all wear retarded bling bling shit
    all smoke dope, all talking about hoes an pimping some boxes
     
  22. Undercovermc [|]

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    If someone said that hip-hop and rap was a fad, that was a joke to me because they just didn't know what they were talking about. - Jam Master Jay

    The OP isn't asking anyone to bash Rap/Hip-Hop, so if you don't like Rap/Hip-Hop remove yourself from this thread.
     
  23. Zephos Banned

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    Wait...with what now?

    Claiming your unbias is the ultimate in meaningless claims.

    Prove this plz.

    This is certainly a case of not being able to differentiate content from the cup.
    Rap covers loads and loads of groups/artists and yet because of the most popular being half assed party rap/gagsta rap, its all evil crap.
    Is this not what your saying?

    Popular music? Like what? Hair Metal? Aerosmith? Suicidal Emo music?

    So can you actually define what rap your talking about? Instead of switching it around all willy nilly?
    Some paragraphs its "rap", some its "popular music" some its "popular rap".
    And yet you act indignate when someone can't tell which generalization your making.
     
  24. sel Agatha, This is Magnus

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    There is some good rap yes, people like Talib Kweli and Mos Def [ive heard some tracks off blackstar which were love]

    But most rap people are exposed to nowadays is that mainstream "Gangsta" Lemme steal a tune of led zeppelin, talk about guns and hoes and crack and in my video wear a lot of bling and have bitches shake their asses Bollocks. Rap was faltering and 50 Cents "Get rich or Die Trying" And his "Rise" Was the nail in the coffin to Rap as we know it
     
  25. Batman M.I.S.

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    We all know that anyone willing to make blanket statments without any proof is just looking to start a flame war. We're better Off ignoring his ass.

    On Topic: The worst rapper might be steven tyler. Or Billy Bob Thorton, or the mute kid from qatar, but from the people that actually want to rap as a career, I've heard so much wack street rhyme from cats distributing their albums on the streets.
     
  26. mystictrunks The BOWSS

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    *yauwnz*

    Bar War/Poet Laurette Infinity/ St.Germaine = Most Original thing to come out of music in quite awhile.


    Over 3 billion ways to mix one song, and they all make sense, with proper use of audio channels the possibility of mixing expands even further. 1 hour of audio becomes a life time of music.
     
  27. Kduff Kaizan

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    Haha, I like how all of you do nothing but give the fuck up. If you can't argue, why not just put me down? You fucking lose.

    Bunch of fucking ignorant losers.
     
  28. Lord Yu Active Member

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    It's called not feeding the trolls.

    EDit: OH SHI-!
     
  29. Kduff Kaizan

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    Yeah, because I posted a stupid little joke that wasn't even meant to be taken seriously and you all get your fucking panties in a bunch and start some shit with me. I finish it, and all of you just give the fuck up because you can't argue with someone who doesn't just flame you.

    I'm not the fucking troll. But I'm not going to let a bunch of pussies sit there and insult me over a stupid joke. And I'm definitely not going to let you all give up and insult me and try and act like what I said wasn't true just because you can't argue with it.
     
  30. mystictrunks The BOWSS

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    LOL @ This frail twerp who just got sonned so hard he has to act like he's cool.


    Show me better lyrics than Poet Laurette/2/Infinity and the entire Rip the Kacer CD and I might consider your opinion.

    You know nothing of hip-hop outside of mainstream material.


    Fallback son

    *yauwnz*
     
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