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Sasuke struggled in all his fights, so why is his power inflation so mishandled?

Discussion in 'New Leaf' started by Linkmyboy72, May 30, 2018.

  1. Linkmyboy72 Well-Known Member

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    Sasuke so far has never had a legit one on one where he legit fought at a superior level against his rivaling opponent with the opponent trying to fight at full killing strength. He's always been hyped to death as on another level, but feat wise he either jobs or the opponent is nerfed from completely humiliating him, with him inches of being defeated/killed till the last second, but thats Plot Armor for you. I feel this one of the problems Kishimoto failed to use Sasuke at as a important role and compelling character, Sasuke never once felt superior to anyone he faced in combat as much as his brother and Madara did. Naruto and him were always neck and neck, Killer Bee and A proved he was still a infant in ninja mastery and taijutsu, he needed escapes and help against ninjas that are to old to fight back like Orochimaru and Danzou, and he literally felt like a errand boy to Naruto's boss in the Kaguya fight. Yet out of no where, Kishimoto still had to write Sasuke progress in power so spur of the moment he had the most PIS moments and issues with his ninjutusu and eye realated techniques by just nearly dying, thats stupid.

    At least rivals like Vegeta and Bakugou were smarter combat geniuses with a power complex and used their genius every chapter they were in a fight, Sasuke was written to be a psychotic manchild who treated people as ants to crush only for him to get crushed himself. When rivals feel the need to walk over others, theres usually no chance for the opposition to do anything to them accept the main character, Sasuke got trolled by non ninjutsu ninjas and to me was the easiest shonen rival for the main lead to catch up to since Goku vs Vegeta, Naruto learned his game breaker abilities in chapter 1 for petes sake.
     
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  2. Batzzaro29 Well-Known Member

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    > The guy survives fighting 5 Kage & kills soon to be one.

    Kid thinks he jobs...
    :leo
     
  3. Linkmyboy72 Well-Known Member

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    Only with meat shields and unlimited heal potions aka blood cocktails. Sasuke and his team would have never would have lived without Obito either.
     
  4. Milliardo G.L.P.

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    What? Vegeta got punked on all the time. :lmao

    Also Sasuke a manchild? He was a teenager in part 2...I think you mean Madara or Obito.


    Naruto was always broken because he had unlimited chakra and could multiple himself like 1000 times. The author had to gimp him to make his fights interesting.


    Sasuke vs Deidara Sasuke could have killed him before the massive explosion so not every fight. :grin
     
  5. Linkmyboy72 Well-Known Member

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    Vegeta always rivaled Goku and even won against him, just because he jobbed alot doesn't mean he's like Sasuke in fighting and getting straight up whooped.

    Deidara was the special wrapped pakage Sasuke got as a fight in terms of elemental advantage and prepped power. If Sasuke wasn't that resourceful against future fights, he'd loses easily. And if Sasuke could had killed him, how easy would you think Itachi or Bee would have done?
     
  6. Plexa Well-Known Member

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    The reason Sasuke seemed to struggle in a lot of fights is that he exclusively fought very, very strong people.
     
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  7. Linkmyboy72 Well-Known Member

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    Which were too strong to be non villains or important in the plot. Sasuke unlike other top tier Uchiha's was handled poorly in sacraficing his hype to other characters feat wise in power inflation, since in the end most of the characters Sasuke lost to, were punked by most of the villains later on.
     
  8. saradax 8th Hokage

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    He made Kakashi not take him easy and not being able to read his book - even touched his bells, he easily beat those hidden mist ninja that attacked them while Naruto froze, he was fighting toe-to-toe with Haku and ended up saving Naruto's ass giving up his life (even tho he didn't die), gave Orochimaru a hell of a fight, he blitzed and broke the sound guy's arms, he won the chunin exam match while in excruciating pain from the curse seal without using any ninjutsu or sharingan, he was the first person to ever make Gaara bleed even when he was in his sand barrier and technically he won that match since after that Gaara went 1 tail beast crazy and would be disqualified, he humiliated and owned Temari, he fought possessed Gaara for a good while until the curse mark paralyzed him then beat Naruto even in his cloak mode and left him half dead. And I could go like this all day long.
    In Shippuden he owned the entire new 7 and could've killed them if Orochimaru had no intervened, killed and absorbed Orochimaru, defeated Deidara and made him blow himself up out of salt, he managed to permanently cripple a Raikage for life and killed Danzo who was the hokage at the time, he blitzed and cut SO6P Madara in half, hit Kaguya while Naruto was busy crying for Obito then they both sealed her, and fodderized all the tailed beasts with a single glance.
    Funny you said Vegeta is better when he is biggest jobber in shonen. :sauceskully
     
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  9. Arles Celes The Psychologist

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    Meh, in pretty much 90% of manga fights there always was some "worf had the flu" element, holding back or some other excuse for the loser to save face. Sasori seemingly let Chiyo kill him, Naruto had help against Kakuzu, Itachi was lacking kill intent against Sasuke, Pain was lacking KI against Naruto, Danzou couldn't use Koto against Sasuke and the likes of Obito/Madara/Kaguya were team wins rather than soloing.
     
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  10. Linkmyboy72 Well-Known Member

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    And thats makes it okay, even though he got his ass kicked in the end, just not as easily, which is a thing, Sasuke gets stomped and humiliated but he gets it's much less than others because the aurthor doesn't want him to be too pathetic.
    1. Naruto easily redeemed himself afterwards against the Team 7 vs. Zabuza fight, 2. Don't know what level they were, designated fodder makes anyone seem impressive, but in the end Naruto defeated the main big bad Haku while Sasuke layed there being nearly killed.
    Still passed out like a pussy.
    No, he amused Oro like a kid playing with a toy and knew he'd die if Oro was taking this seriously.
    Again fodder showings don't count
    Okay, Sakura passed the written exam doesn't mean she's a showed consistent results either[/QUOTE]
    Fight was disqualified So Sasuke didn't win anything.
    And Naruto beat all the superior ninjas that could kick Temari's ass easily during the chunnin exams
    A good while? he barely scratched him and Gaara rapped him in close quarters combat. Naruto was intending to knock out Sasuke and through his entire mindset, naruto subconsciously sandbagged himself in fighting Sasuke when falling for Sasuke's bluff of a forehead protector challenge. If Naruto was series and intended to kill him, he would have easily thanks to Naruto and Kyuubi one tailed Rasengan.
    Naruto literally was like a ex girlfriend at that point and didn't have the heart to fight, Naruto somehow did better than I expected and could literally give Sasuke a hell of a fight with only kage bushin spam if he had to fight. Again the team wasn't prepared to kill him so Sasuke literally beaten them as harmlessly as they possibly could.
    A sick and in his death bed Oro
    See previous post, any other Akatsuki would kill Sasuke easily. And if Bee showed, they would have to be completely holding back to let him preform as best he possibly can in a fight.
    He did nothing to A, A had made him his bitch and to my displeasure a cuck in his own power tier.
    A old out of shape Danzou, who managed to still keep up with him, tire him out forcing Sasuke to heal with a living healing potion each enton tatic and a Kage who underestimated him the entire fight.
    Which was nothing since Madara stabbed him back couple panels later killing him with ease.
    Sasuke did nothing but help naruto, he did nothing that held her at bay like Naruto did.
    And alas Naruto got all their powers and used them against Sasuke while again holding back from killing him at full power.
    intentionally, Vegeta held himself back because he was too prideful in himself and could and has kept up if not stay superior to Goku throughout the majority of the series, Sasuke was always behind Naruto and only got magical external power ups that would hold Naruto at bay but in the end would get overpowered since he's still a glass cannon compared to Naruto's monsterous super humanity. The author probably says their equal because he doesn't want Sasuke fans to commit suicide. Even though his feats in the manga contridict the databook in saying Sasuke is easily superior than Naruto in some aspects, he never showed these feats in the manga and was a glorified jobber and weakling compared to naruto and itachi.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2018
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  11. saradax 8th Hokage

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    Your favorite character is Kakashi that makes you a huge hypocrite since he's the most overhyped character in the series. He also needs help in his fights. Nigga keeps praising himself that he knows 1000 jutsu yet he uses like 10 in the entire series.
    He needed some genin help to rescue him in the Zabuza arc from water prison, he's overhyped as shit.
     
  12. Linkmyboy72 Well-Known Member

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    Kakashi made sasuke his bitch in the kaguya fight and was always a prototype sasuke done right, without the retarded teenage edge and being a shit low tier kage level ninja amongst his opponents(needing extra hand outs and eye upgrades instead of pure raw skill obtained from learning). And Sasuke's sucks in taijutsu compared to Kakashi, what kinda of cool and talented shonen rival type isn't a near demi god in pure physical fighting skills? Sasuke thats who.
     
  13. saradax 8th Hokage

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    Lemme know when Kakashi can do that against an OP otsutsuki alien with one hand lmfao. Stupidest shit I read all day.
    Kakashi almost got killed by a fucking meteorite in "The Last" if it wasn't for Sasuke saving his ass.
     
  14. Arthas Anko's Lover

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    I agreee with the OP in general at least as far as the Post - Itachi fights were concerned.

    There are multiple problems with how Sasuke was developed (battle-ability) wise after the Itachi fight (and a few before them).

    The Deidara fight is in my view the Gold Standard for Sasuke's fights in Shippuden (as long as you disregard the great snake escape.) Elemental advantage was present but Sasuke's intelligence, strategy and fighting ability were all highlighted.

    The Itachi fight was the same, Sasuke attacked his brother with calm hatred and had plans counters for all of Itachi's abilities that he knew about (Sasuke did not know about Susanoo).

    The problems with the Itachi fight came later when Kishi just had to highlight that Itachi was SICK and GOING BLIND and STILL HOLDING BACK.

    Worf didn't have a flu, Worf had a flu, fever and pneumonia. One of these problems would have been enough, all of them is just taking the piss out of Sasuke's abilities.

    However it was Sasuke's post Itachi's fights that really take the cake:

    Impressions on Sasuke's fights below:
    Spoiler:


    Bee:

    - Kishi tried to give Sasuke the excuse that Sasuke was injured. He gave this excuse in the exact same fight that Karin demonstrated her HEALING abilities. What did Karin just forget to heal Sasuke after the Itachi fight? Not to mention Sasuke did not actually receive serious injuries in his fight with Itachi.

    - Kishi makes a joke of Sharingan prediction during the fight. Congrats, the difference between Bee and Sasuke is greater the KN-0 Naruto and Sasuke at VotE.

    - Bee praises Sasuke as being the strongest that he ever fought which is why he transformed into Eight Tails. Except Bee had already 'Killed' Sasuke multiple times by then and Sasuke had not shown much of a threat.

    - Also first instance of Amaterasu nerfing comes into play.

    Kage-Arc:

    - Kishi describes Sasuke as being a brilliant warrior. Kishi then writes him fighting like a two year old throwing a tantrum.

    - Itachi has MS for 10 years without going blind? Sasuke has his for 10 weeks at BEST.

    - Amaterasu nerfing speeds up.

    - Danzo fight looks nice until you consider Danzo is as old as Hiruzen being as fast as Sasuke who has MS enchanced reactions. Not to mention Susanoo spam apparently the only way to counter Izanagi as a strategy. (It seemed like that was more a way for Kishi to justify MS blindness then actually being the best strategy against Danzo.)

    - Can any one tell me any reason why it is better to fire a Susanoo-Kagetsuichi arrow which is slow enough to be Kamui'd instead Amaterasuing Kakashi directly? (This sums up one of the main issues with people saying Kagetsuichi is an upgrade).

    Kabuto - Fight:

    - Sasuke apparently needs his hand held by Itachi despite having EMS and is unable to take the lead.

    I won't bother with the rest except the fact that Sasuke suddenly seemed worthless against anyone important and his abilities were either nerfed (anyone else remember chakra rods blocking a Kagetsuichi arrow? Again Amaterasu the target directly) or simply blocked by a need Sage Mode Wall that appeared all of a sudden.


    What makes it all the worse for Sasuke is that the Prime-Villians were Dojutsu wielders who were better at Dojutsu (or had better Dojutsu) then he did, yet he is the Uchiha with the MOST Potential (Ha ha ha...)

    Kamui for example is so good that people compare it to the Rinnegan, heck it was able injure Kaguya while Amaterasu was laughed off.

    To put it simply :

    Other Uchiha/Dojutus Wielders: Demonstrate OP abilities and are effective.

    Sasuke : Either does not get those abilities or is plain in-effective with those abilites or shows how those abilities can be defeated.
     
  15. Brooks N'Jadaka/Erik Killmonger

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    Vegeta? :kobeha

    Are we talking about the same Vegeta whose whole life revolved around taking L's at every turn?

    If that is the case. Then you also hold this L nigga.
     
  16. Csdabest O.Y.D. Chris Styles

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    He fought an army of samurai along with 5 kages abd escorts. Why cant he have his 3 little homies
     
  17. Csdabest O.Y.D. Chris Styles

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    They Gimped Sasuke at the half way point. He literally was banned from using Senjutsu fill the last 30 chapters. Probabaly less. While power inflation was escalating.

    Naruto Got to stack Kyuubi Chakra with Senjutsu chakra.

    While Sasuke has to trade Senjutsu chakra for Mangekyo. Naruto would of never caught up
     
  18. Linkmyboy72 Well-Known Member

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    this.

    CIS?

    I didn't know Sasuke was a senju or a yang descendant, and even if he learned senjutsu, Naruto still beat him in stats and raw power naturally.
     
  19. SaiST 鎧袖一触 Retired Staff

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    Arthas does a pretty good job of summing up my feelings on the development of Sasuke's abilities. Despite all the hype surrounding the potential of his dōryoku, and his prodigious talent, Kishimoto did a pretty terrible job of portraying it.

    I have at least a couple of posts I've made in the past that go further in-depth on this matter, but I'm on my mobile device, and have no desire to dig them up now.

    It'd be one thing if he got all of this hype and it was acknowledged in the actual narrative that he just couldn't match it... But Kishimoto persisted in having him percieved this way. It's a little baffling.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2018
  20. Parzival PCSX2

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    Bee took that fool to school (Fool Ya Fools)
     
  21. Linkmyboy72 Well-Known Member

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    Ehh, Madara redeemed the Uchihas when he back handed A and B with Naruto to the back of the bus. And not that Sasuke was that weak and pathetic, he just got his new MS and had the entirety of his CS ripped out of him.
     
  22. Csdabest O.Y.D. Chris Styles

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    You dont need to be a Senju or a Yang descendent To use senjutsu. Curse Seal Transformation is another form of Senjutsu outside of Sage Mode. At the end of Itachi fight before White Snake and Curse Seal was removed. Sasuke was gaining the Markings around his eyes of a true sage. Kabuto completed that process but attached a bunch of bloodline to hinself.

    With the power of the senjutsu Curse Seal sasuke was able to use chakra to take over Orochimaru Dimension that he created for himself.

    kishi cut Sasuke balls off so he can catch up.
     
  23. Arthas Anko's Lover

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    Agreed.

    What really makes this clear to all is that Kishi did this while also putting in a "Must have Senjutsu to hurt enemy" barrier against the end tier opponents.
     
  24. Linkmyboy72 Well-Known Member

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    Honestly I don't remember any fight were sasuke looked good after deidara, his fight with bee and a completely destroyed his intimadating reputation as the ultra badass Kishimoto made him out as from the start of part 2. Adult Sasuke is a bit better but he never got his own equavilent to Toneri or Kaguya solo fight where he was a total ass kicking machine and had the upper hand through out the battle.
     
  25. Milliardo G.L.P.

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    Sasuke should have legitimately beat Itachi. Thats where Kishi really cut his balls off...

    Had Sasuke completed his goal like he should have I wouldn't have cared what happened to him after that.

    He could have made him crazy and retarded all the same but I would have been satisfied.
     
  26. Arthas Anko's Lover

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    Looking back at the issue, this was part of the problem along with the problem of MS abilities in general.

    There was never really an opponent for Sasuke to fight & defeat at EMS or even Rinnegan tier. (Heck, I'd argue the same with MS tier).

    Sasuke's opponents either had plot relevance which is why they could not be killed/defeated by Sasuke (this would include the Kages and opponents like Obito & Madara) or were being saved for someone else to defeat (Kabuto for example.)

    Danzo was perhaps the only MS tier opponent Sasuke was allowed to beat and that fight was far from the best as far as tactics or even fighting ability was being showcased (I do applaud the genjutsu at the end though). Susanoo spam came into full play over here and I have yet to understand how Sasuke ( a young ninja noted for his speed and with MS reaction boost) NEEDED to be in Susanoo (who whould now be older then Hiruzen when he died and had his MS eye covered) in order to pressure Danzo to use Izanagi?

    The other problem is MS abilities in general.

    My personal opion is that Kishi made a big mistake in giving Sasuke MS at all. Kishi should have given Sasuke a more *Unique* power up.

    Sasuke having MS & EMS & Rinnegan means that his abilities would always be compared to villains who had the same type of dojutsu.

    See all the villains main abilities were from their magic eyes. If Sasuke's magic eyes were equal to or better then theirs then the Villains would not be a threat and Villains need to be a threat or you don't get a story.

    This meant no one ever got the impression that Sasuke's Magic Eyes were ever Top Tier. Some one else always had better ones.

    It would be like Naruto always always having one opponent or another who was better at SM then he was or a better Jinchuuriki then he was.

    Problem with this is the story now becomes :

    Naruto: Best there ever was with SM and even was the Perfect Jinchuuriki of the most powerful tailed beast.

    Sakura: Byakugou mode equal to Tsunade and arguably better since she does not waste chakra on Youthful Body Genjutsu transformation.

    Sasuke: Magic Eyes with worse portrayal then all the end game characters who also had magic eyes.
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2018
  27. Milliardo G.L.P.

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    Tsunade's transformation isn't genjutsu Arthas.

    I do agree with Sasuke getting a power up outside of Sharingan that would have been very interesting. At very least Sasuke should of had his own unique MS abilities.
     
  28. Arthas Anko's Lover

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    Fixed thanks.
     
  29. Linkmyboy72 Well-Known Member

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    Great I agree on all of this, but Sasuke had more natural talent in oher ninja fields didn't he, why didn't Kishimoto make him a equal to A and B in physical swordsmanship/taijutsu enhancement like Naruto. I don't get why the main rival isn't on par with the main lead in a pure brawl fest when the manga establishes this as one of the best elements of naruto fights.
     
  30. TheOmega Real Nigga

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    Danzo & Deidara but other than that he was scrubgang LOL
     
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