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Shanks is stronger than Mihawk

Skaddix

Well-Known Member
Mihawk couldnt even break Vista down lol. As noted Vista with Marco got bodied by Akainu.

Granted Marineford was weird.

Still I should note that Kuzan sent Doffy running for the hills without a fight. The same Doffy he had no problem trying to off Fuji and a whole island with bird cage.
 

Sablés

Well-Known Member
So less importance to the loss of Mihawk then, as opposed to the dissolution of the Warlord system itself. Because it's the latter that matters, not the former's own strength, who supposedly is tiers above the others if we were to scale him to an Admiral much less an Emperor. Again, not helping in his portrayal as a Pirate with the same potential as Shanks, much less the likes of Kaido or BM.
Yep. If the admirals were to be disbanded, nobody would single out any individual admiral. They would just say 'the admirals' because it encompasses the total loss of that military power. But if say, Kuzan defected, they would obviously just single him out in particular. You are reaching like crazy with this.
The Kuzan that destroyed Jozu the moment his back was turned? Where if you were to switch the two's positions the best Jozu could manage is a bloody lip?
Yup.

Whitebeard even let Jozu handle Aokiji himself. How does this overturn the fact that Aokiji needed an opening to beat Jozu, and was being stalled by Jozu beforehand in a pure 1 vs 1 battle? At most, this just proves that Aokiji's attack power was higher but not enough to let him defeat Jozu at the time.
Vista isn't even worth mentioning, as he couldn't even stop Akainu along with Marco who is certainly not in the realm of modern Emperor class.

Guess this means Emperors >>> Admirals. I wonder who right now is actually threatening the emperor famed as the strongest and known for his durability.
 

Sablés

Well-Known Member
Never forget that Aokiji, the guy equal to Akainu, had a named attack get nullified by Ace, and that Sengoku using his devil fruit couldn't stop a rookie from escaping him with the centerpiece of the entire war effort.

The cherry picking is unreal. You can trash the admirals just as easy as you would Mihawk using that logic. :lmao
 

LightningForce

Well-Known Member
Yep. If the admirals were to be disbanded, nobody would single out any individual admiral. They would just say 'the admirals' because it encompasses the total loss of that military power. But if say, Kuzan defected, they would obviously just single him out in particular. You are reaching like crazy with this.

Yup.

Whitebeard even let Jozu handle Aokiji himself. How does this overturn the fact that Aokiji needed an opening to beat Jozu, and was being stalled by Jozu beforehand? At most, this just proves that Aokiji's attack power was higher.


Guess this means Emperors >>> Admirals. I wonder who right now is actually threatening the emperor famed as the strongest and known for his durability.
I meant Marco isn’t in the realm of Emperor class, not Akainu.
 

Lee-Sensei

The Clown Prince of Crime
You just proved my point. The Warlords as a whole are formidable. Them losing Mihawk is in the same vein, more or less, as losing Weevil or Hancock. But losing just one nowhere near the loss as losing someone like Kuzan as is portrayed.

Mihawk’s portrayal has not been in his favor, he is not in the same realm as Emperors or even Admirals, all the more so if they don’t send an Admiral to capture him when we find out later what happens. And this is being nice considering what his best feats were in MF (lol Jozu and Vista).
I’d bet my left nut that Hancock is far weaker than Mihawk and Weevil is probably comfortably beneath him too.
 

TheOmega

They Said I Be Trollin. Where?
Ya know it boggles my mind that despite 75% of the fandom stanning Zoro, they want his character journey to be a complete joke. Because yes, that’s what it would be if Mihawk has been a fraud the whole time making the WSS title mean nothing.

People try to work around that by creating a headcanon that there’s some weird technicality that absolves Shanks from swordsmanship but is that really how you want Zoro to achieve his dream? On a technicality? Zoro can only achieve his dream because Shanks isn’t in his way? So lame man.

As of right now, Oda has given us no reason to think Shanks is anything but a swordsman. I’ll happily eat my words if that changes but I can’t imagine how it would unless Shanks can truly tap into “Ultra Haki God Mode” while not using a sword anymore.

I find this whole train of thought weird as fuck tbh.

If Shanks isn't classed as a swordsman it doesn't matter if he's stronger than Mihawk. And he IS stronger than Mihawk which is what leads us to believe that he indeed ISN'T classified as a swordsman just like BM, WB, Kizaru & Aokiji aren't despite using swords.

Most of us believe Shanks is around prime Rayleigh level. Most of us believe Zoro will reach and surpass Prime Rayleigh level as Luffy reaches and surpasses Gol D Roger's level.

That means we believe Zoro will surpass Shanks.

We know Rayleigh trained Shanks.

We know Rayleigh is a Haki Expert.

We know Shanks is a Haki Expert.

We know there's ways to use Haki besides merely making your sword harder or being able to cut logias.

We know Shanks has ALWAYS been known to have STRONG Haki. And we know he became a Yonko DESPITE losing his dominant sword arm.

This means that he's got a tool in his arsenal that is good enough to compensate for the loss of his dominant hand. Gee what could possibly make up for a lack of a strong hand?🤔

He's switched hands, so it can't be that got an arm replacement. He still has his sword so it's not a new weapon. He either got a devil fruit or WAIT! Maybe he has access to a magical spiritual ability that is dependent on the user's Spirit and not their physique...OH YEAAH HAKI. Duh🤷🏽‍♂️

Haki is the obvious factor in Shanks dominance as a pirate.

Shanks being a sword wielding Haki Specialist does not make him a swordsman anymore than being a martial artist who throws kicks makes you a boxer🤷🏽‍♂️

The same way you can become the best boxer in the world without beating or fighting every single person who throws punches is the same way you can be the WSS without fighting or beating every person who has a sword. This is COMMON SENSE. YA NEED TO PUT YA THINKIN CAPS ON.

Luffy is stronger than Zoro.

Luffy had was using a sword in Wano.

Was Luffy a swordsman? Was Luffy a stronger swordsman than Zoro?

Use ya brains and not your emotions.

Shanks > Mihawk Overall
Mihawk > Shanks with Pure Swordplay itself

Shanks is stronger than Mihawk, Mihawk is the WSS & Zoro will surpass them both.

Simple🤷🏽‍♂️
 

TheOmega

They Said I Be Trollin. Where?
Mihawk couldnt even break Vista down lol. As noted Vista with Marco got bodied by Akainu.

Granted Marineford was weird.

Still I should note that Kuzan sent Doffy running for the hills without a fight. The same Doffy he had no problem trying to off Fuji and a whole island with bird cage.

Doffly was alone against Aokiji. He was literally planning to gangstomp Fujitora with his whole crew. 1V1 Fuji spanks Doffly
 

TheOmega

They Said I Be Trollin. Where?
Are you implying that swordsmanship and haki are mutually exclusive? :mikebatman

I'm saying if you are capable enough in one then they branch off to their own shit.

MMA guys use punches, kicks, elbows, knees and grabs. Boxers specialize in punch throwing. We call them boxers, we don't call MMA guys boxers🤷🏽‍♂️ Use that noggin buddy

Connor McGregor > Floyd Mayweather Overall
Floyd Mayweather > Connor McGregor in Pure Boxing

This is really not a hard concept to grasp.
 

Sablés

Well-Known Member
I'm saying if you are capable enough in one then they branch off to their own shit.

MMA guys use punches, kicks, elbows, knees and grabs. Boxers specialize in punch throwing. We call them boxers, we don't call MMA guys boxers🤷🏽‍♂️ Use that noggin buddy

Connor McGregor > Floyd Mayweather Overall
Floyd Mayweather > Connor McGregor in Pure Boxing

This is really not a hard concept to grasp.
That's a false equivalence.

Haki is not a style by itself. It's a supplement.
 

TheOmega

They Said I Be Trollin. Where?
Luffy is a Haki specialist at this point.

He's definitely starting to get there. I don't think he's fully there yet but depending on how he develops his CoA3 use he may very well start to enter that domain.

I think someone like Sabo is closer with how he used CoA to breath break the core of the arena
 

Lee-Sensei

The Clown Prince of Crime
Well obviously Lee....Hancock is a Female. Watch her job out to fucking Cody, a defeat so bad it will make Big Meme look good.
It has nothing to do with her being a woman. Big Moms a woman, and she’d probably give Mihawk an extreme diff fight. Losing to Koby wouldn’t be jobbing either. You just have a perception of his level that’s not in line with how he’s being portrayed.
 

Skaddix

Well-Known Member
It has nothing to do with her being a woman. Big Moms a woman, and she’d probably give Mihawk an extreme diff fight. Losing to Koby wouldn’t be jobbing either. You just have a perception of his level that’s not in line with how he’s being portrayed.

What has Koby actually shown lol.
 

Lee-Sensei

The Clown Prince of Crime
What has Koby actually shown lol.
Not much to be fair, but what has Dragon shown? No. I’m not saying that he’s equal to Dragon. I’m saying that his portrayal indicates that he’s relatively strong. Losing to him won’t be jobbing. Jobbing is when a character far more powerful than another character loses to someone they have no business losing to. Koby‘s Haki was stated to be on a very advanced level and he’s mastered Rokushiki. He’s been in the New World fighting for over 2 years. He has the ability to measure people’s strengths and years of experience now, but he seems pretty confident. It’s possible that he goes to Amazon Lily and gets curbstomped, but that doesn’t seem to be where Oda is going with this.

 

Skaddix

Well-Known Member
Not much to be fair, but what has Dragon shown? No. I’m not saying that he’s equal to Dragon. I’m saying that his portrayal indicates that he’s relatively strong. Losing to him won’t be jobbing. Jobbing is when a character far more powerful than another character loses to someone they have no business losing to. Koby‘s Haki was stated to be on a very advanced level and he’s mastered Rokushiki. He’s been in the New World fighting for over 2 years. He has the ability to measure people’s strengths and years of experience now, but he seems pretty confident. It’s possible that he goes to Amazon Lily and gets curbstomped, but that doesn’t seem to be where Oda is going with this.


I mean Dragon is described as the most dangerous man alive, is the son of a marine GOAT, and is the father of the protag future pirate GOAT. Also outside of him Sabo is the strongest in his whole faction which means he kinda has to be powerful to carry the load lol. Basically Dragon is assumed to be strong because the rules of Shonen state that he will be.

Koby doesn't really have those factors.
 

Lee-Sensei

The Clown Prince of Crime
I mean Dragon is described as the most dangerous man alive, is the son of a marine GOAT, and is the father of the protag future pirate GOAT. Also outside of him Sabo is the strongest in his whole faction which means he kinda has to be powerful to carry the load lol. Basically Dragon is assumed to be strong because the rules of Shonen state that he will be.

Koby doesn't really have those factors.
You mean like Spandam and Buggy being the strongest people in their Crews?

Koby is Garps protege, has been fighting in the New World for the past 2 years, mastered Rokushiki in under 3 and has CoO on a very advanced level according to Oda. His Haki range was so great that he was able to scope out a torpedo from a ship so far away that the Dressrossa group didn’t know it was there (including Viola and CoO users like Rebecca and Helmeppo), dived into the rough waters of the New World, swam fast enough to over take it, was strong enough to forcibly deflect it and ranked an explosion that dwarfed their ship. This was all done casually. Granted, that doesn’t mean that he’s on Hancocks level (and I don’t think he’s there yet). But it is indicative of where Oda places him. There’s also this.

 

Skaddix

Well-Known Member
You mean like Spandam and Buggy being the strongest people in their Crews?

Koby is Garps protege, has been fighting in the New World for the past 2 years, mastered Rokushiki in under 3 and has CoO on a very advanced level according to Oda. His Haki range was so great that he was able to scope out a torpedo from a ship so far away that the Dressrossa group didn’t know it was there (including Viola and CoO users like Rebecca and Helmeppo), dived into the rough waters of the New World, swam fast enough to over take it, was strong enough to forcibly deflect it and ranked an explosion that dwarfed their ship. This was all done casually. Granted, that doesn’t mean that he’s on Hancocks level (and I don’t think he’s there yet). But it is indicative of where Oda places him. There’s also this.


Spandam and Buggy are irrelevant if Sabo is the strongest Revolutionary. The WG has nothing to be afraid of.
Also u didnt address my point of Shonen Fathers rarely being weak if they are story relevant.
Dragon is the son of a powerhouse, and the father of a powerhouse. All the rules suggest he is going to be a powerhouse.

Whether Koby is strong or not is nowhere near as relevant lol as Dragon. Koby's relevance will be in the Epilogue lol. Also he is going to have show up in a fight for me to give him respect.

Comparing Dragon and Koby though absurd.
 

TheOmega

They Said I Be Trollin. Where?
U really think Doffly crew would have been relevant considering how fast Kuzan can drop AOE?
Man would have frozen them all before they did jack/

Bro I'm not the one claiming he was gonna use his crew against Aokiji. I'm saying Doflamingo himself was planning to use his entries crew against Fujitora if he had to.

He was talkin shit cuz he was gonna jump him.

He had nobody to jump Aokiji with so he wasn't talkin shit. Simple.

READ What I write, don't just react🤷🏽‍♂️

Yea he might be able to take Aokiji with his entire crew.

All it really takes is trippin/occupying Aokiji enough for Sugar to land that toy touch and then boom GG Kuzan🤷🏽‍♂️

Doffly plus his whole gang should definitely add up to enough power to match and overcome an Admiral
 

JustSumGuy

The True SNIPER KING
I find this whole train of thought weird as fuck tbh.

If Shanks isn't classed as a swordsman it doesn't matter if he's stronger than Mihawk. And he IS stronger than Mihawk which is what leads us to believe that he indeed ISN'T classified as a swordsman just like BM, WB, Kizaru & Aokiji aren't despite using swords.

Most of us believe Shanks is around prime Rayleigh level. Most of us believe Zoro will reach and surpass Prime Rayleigh level as Luffy reaches and surpasses Gol D Roger's level.

That means we believe Zoro will surpass Shanks.

We know Rayleigh trained Shanks.

We know Rayleigh is a Haki Expert.

We know Shanks is a Haki Expert.

We know there's ways to use Haki besides merely making your sword harder or being able to cut logias.

We know Shanks has ALWAYS been known to have STRONG Haki. And we know he became a Yonko DESPITE losing his dominant sword arm.

This means that he's got a tool in his arsenal that is good enough to compensate for the loss of his dominant hand. Gee what could possibly make up for a lack of a strong hand?🤔

He's switched hands, so it can't be that got an arm replacement. He still has his sword so it's not a new weapon. He either got a devil fruit or WAIT! Maybe he has access to a magical spiritual ability that is dependent on the user's Spirit and not their physique...OH YEAAH HAKI. Duh🤷🏽‍♂️

Haki is the obvious factor in Shanks dominance as a pirate.

Shanks being a sword wielding Haki Specialist does not make him a swordsman anymore than being a martial artist who throws kicks makes you a boxer🤷🏽‍♂️

The same way you can become the best boxer in the world without beating or fighting every single person who throws punches is the same way you can be the WSS without fighting or beating every person who has a sword. This is COMMON SENSE. YA NEED TO PUT YA THINKIN CAPS ON.

Luffy is stronger than Zoro.

Luffy had was using a sword in Wano.

Was Luffy a swordsman? Was Luffy a stronger swordsman than Zoro?

Use ya brains and not your emotions.

Shanks > Mihawk Overall
Mihawk > Shanks with Pure Swordplay itself

Shanks is stronger than Mihawk, Mihawk is the WSS & Zoro will surpass them both.

Simple🤷🏽‍♂️
I’m sorry I cannot relate Luffy wielding a sword one time to Shanks consistently being portrayed as a swordsman to the point where he’s been touted as rival to Mihawk. Literally every time we see Shanks he uses a sword. It’s how he fights.

Mihawk will also be a “haki specialist” when you get down to it. He’ll be buso specialist or else how else could he handle probably the blackest blade in the series. He’ll be a kenbo specialist because he’s literally called “hawk eye”. And I even think he‘ll have Kings Haki too.

You state Shanks is stronger than Mihawk as if it’s a fact but you have no evidence to support this claim. Because he’s a yonko? Who cares, Mihawk is not a pirate captain. Is it because when they had duels Shanks wasn’t yet a yonko? Well guess what, Mihawk has improved too since then and probably wasn’t the WSS at the time.
 

TheOmega

They Said I Be Trollin. Where?
Spandam and Buggy are irrelevant if Sabo is the strongest Revolutionary. The WG has nothing to be afraid of.
Also u didnt address my point of Shonen Fathers rarely being weak if they are story relevant.
Dragon is the son of a powerhouse, and the father of a powerhouse. All the rules suggest he is going to be a powerhouse.

Whether Koby is strong or not is nowhere near as relevant lol as Dragon. Koby's relevance will be in the Epilogue lol. Also he is going to have show up in a fight for me to give him respect.

Comparing Dragon and Koby though absurd.


Koby is important as the Righteous underdog that gained courage and opportunity from Luffy. Koby is literally the FIRST person to sail with Luffy. BEFORE Zoro. Coby's dream is akin to being the Marine version of Pirate King. Luffy seeks true Freedom. Koby seeks true Justice. Coby is to Luffy as Luffy is to Shanks. How can you say Coby is irrelevant?

Especially when you cite Shonen tropes in support of Dragon. You should know the kid who gets inpired by the protagonist is gonna have some ridiculous potential, especially since he started off as such a wimp.

Coby's meant to become the strongest Marine and lead them correctly in the same way Luffy is supposed to become the strongest Pirate and lead them correctly
 
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