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third hokage's sealed monster

Discussion in 'Konoha Library Archives' started by Spin, Oct 14, 2004.

  1. Spin New Member

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    don't know if this was ever discussed, but when the hokage falls and basically dies, a clear view of his stomach is shown with a seal much like the one naruto has.

    I base this theory on the following
    Jiraiya commented on naruto's seal that it was made so naruto could tap the nine-tails chakura.
    Kakashi (an others) commented that the hokage is the most powerful ninja in the village. Not that sarutobi is the hokage because he is the strongest in the village, but he is the strongest in the village because he is the hokage.

    So my question is what monster is sealed in third and is it passed from hokage to hokage.
     
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  2. Grandmaster TSE Yondaime is ALIVE!

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    he sealed orochimaru's arms in him
     
  3. souske_05 one pissed kitty

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    yeah thats it. its like when the fourth sealed the fox within naruto, he chose to seal or in himself, but only got to his arms.
     
  4. naruto_117 It's blank here now

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    Well the thirds clones sealed the 1st and 2nd hokage's soul. Would that seal be imprinted on the original 3rd?
     
  5. YamazakiSusumu Just call me Susumu.

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    Wow. What a dumb question. The sealing of Orochimaru's arms spanned over several episodes. How did it not sink in for you? It's the same seal as Naruto's because it's the same jutsu but a little different from what Yondaime did. Sandaime Hokage sealed Orochimaru's arms into himself/Shinigami, but Yondaime sealed the Kyuubi into Naruto instead.
     
  6. Dark Travis Konoha's White Stain

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    Jeez, did you not notice what was happening right before you saw that bit?
     
  7. Omote Renge ...I'm just here.

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    Yeah, it was Orochimaru's arms. I guess you didn't watch carefully enough.
     
  8. Spin New Member

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    I just read it differently. I think that the seal was the conduit that tapped that monsters chakra to reave souls. How much chakra would he need to accomplish that? Whenever we see naruto filling his body with nine-tails chakra, it always starts at the seal and spreads. The way I interpreted the hokages refined move was he didn't want it to spread his body and could control that. This jutsu needed all the chakra directly to work and even drained him (killing him).

    edit: am I the only one that read the comic that way?
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2004
  9. Inmetsu the Beast Yajuu Kenkyaku

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    i'm sorry but that has to be one of the dumbest questions i've heard on the forums..know your simple naruto facts so people cannot make a fool of you man
     
  10. Spin New Member

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    I know the panes from the comic. But those aren't facts. I interpret the panes differently. Is there a mistake in my interpretation? Is it clearly contradicted somewhere else in the comic?
     
  11. Spin New Member

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    The way I interpret the chakra arm (with what appears to be a different kind of seal on it) is the chakra was molded straight from the already formed seal tapping into another source of chakra. It reminds me of the chakra claws of the kyuubi that surrounded naruto.

    When reading the chapter when hokage died and seeing the seal, I thought if that was a seal for the first two hokages and part of orochimaru's soul, then orochimaru would take the hokage's body to undue the seal.

    With naruto's kyuubi seal, there are many instances when various characters note the possibility of the seal being broken which would mean kyuubi is released back into the world to cause destruction and so forth. This makes me think anything that can be seal can also be unsealed. I don't think the souls of the first two hokages and part of orochimaru's were ever sealed in the hokage.

    That was my take, and I thought others as well.
     
  12. Inmetsu the Beast Yajuu Kenkyaku

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    It is simple. The 3rd didn't have a seal on his stomach before hand. He only got it when he sealed Orochimaru's arms into himself. Only until he performed that jutsu did he have the seal on his stomach. He sealed the arms into himself. Then his life was taken as part of the jutsu's contract with the Death God.
     
  13. Spin New Member

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    I don't remember, did we ever see the hokage's stomach before that jutsu?
     
  14. Vatatzes run around headless

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    Pretty dumb question.

    Sorry thats all i had to say...
     
  15. Spin New Member

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    thanks for adding to the conversation. I actually put some thought into the comic.

    The anime clearly shows the clear stomachs of the hokage's bushins but not in the comic. Only after all the action do we see the stomach of the bushins and they have a seal. A clear problem with the idea that the seal happens after the fact is that the bushins could not act as a container for anything. Plainly, the previous hokages could not be sealed in a bushin.

    Through further thought and review of the comic I have settled on the following theory. The hokage did seal something inside his body in chapter 123 that could also be replicated with a kage bushin and it have interesting implications for naruto. He sealed the bringer of darkness. The jutsu is to seal the bringer of darkness and use his power to rip out souls and throw them into darkness. Once a conduit is built into the original body that gives access to a source of chakra, it can be divided amongst the kage bushins. That should mean that when naruto does his favorite move, his kage bushins will be able to use the kyuubi (a fraction of at least) chakra.

    I consider that the anime is inconsistant with the comic in this matter because they interpretted it much like most of you.

    And when the comic refered to orochimaru's ability to mold chakra being sealed, they are only refering to his dead arms and the inability to make a proper seal. His arms are now black since part of his soul has at least felt the darkness.
     
  16. Inmetsu the Beast Yajuu Kenkyaku

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    dude, what is your deal. you can't seal the Death god into you...and i would think the Hokage would have enough chakra to make some kage bunshins...you are really making yourself look retarded because everyone who first saw or read this knew what was going on right away. and you are pondering and making theories about something simple that everyone knows. I'm sorry but it is funny how simple this is..
     
  17. duoenigma Member

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    cut the @$#@ and give the guy a break, dude.....it was oorichumaru arms, the one who sealed the nine tails was the 4th.
     
  18. Spin New Member

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    I was not saying kage bushins would require a rediculous amount of chakra, but they do divide the chakra of the user. it does however take a lot of to mold chakra into an arm and pull out a soul. There is kyuubi and shukaku, I don't see the bringer of darkness as being any different. They are all great monsters of the world and can be considered gods.

    xrock, I was trying to be polite, but I seriously think you misread the chapter or just took your information from the anime. You are wrong.
     
  19. korican04 ftp-nin

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    I'm going to be polite, since no one else isn't.

    The god of death appeared because the 3rd used a jutsu created by the 4th to SUMMON him (the god of death). Much like a summoning contract the god of death was summoned to this world by the third to help him extract the souls of the two hokages and oro. Instead of blood, you have to sacrifice your life.
    Each kage bushin was used as a medium to catch the souls of the hokages. later we see the god of death chop up the heads (each hokage is paired with a head of the third.) and take them in.
    The hokage still needed to finish oro off so he took his hands since that's all the strength he had left. The final act of the jutsu is to put the gathered souls in a place, the jutsu of the 4th places those souls in the belly of choice of the summoner (the 4th chose naruto, the third chose himself). The summoner then gives his life, that's why the third and the 4th are dead and naruto is alive with the seal.

    This all info i got (interpreted) from the chapters, i don't really trust the anime or pay close attention to it unless it's fighitng.

    Maybe you said this but, are you asking weather the hokage had the seal before he did the jutsu?
    Well you asked if the seal is passed down from hokage to hokage...but the 4th created the jutsu that calls on the death god to seal souls. So the third would have had it before the 4th if that's the case but since the 4th created the whole thing the third couldn't have passed it down.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2004
  20. hinatastear naruhina!!

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    the 3rd used his soul to bind orochimarus soul so thay both die the 4 th used his soul to bind kyubi to naruto u use your soul to bind them and u die
     
  21. TreeofSephri Scion of Balance

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    Go easy on the guy. Yes that seal appeared on his stomach when he seal Oro's arms in him.
     
  22. jariroth Woot?

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    Lets see, Third used the same sealing technique that the fourth used to seal kyyubi in Naruto, he just sealed Orochimarus hands in his own stomach.
    Thats why there is a symbol similar to what Naruto has in his stomach. There was something sealed inside their stomach using the same sealing technique.
    Here is proof that he used the same technique that was used to seal kyyubi.
     
  23. Pr0d1gy Narutard

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    Yeah...but wow, seriously dude, you should do your own story it might turn out to be a hit :p
     
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