Discussion in 'New Leaf' started by AxelKross, Jul 9, 2019.
The message is bros for life.
Destiny and bloodlines don't matter unless they matter.
like a brother
kishi style-and yes, that´s a theme-brotherhurts
I read somewhere a while back that kishi based itachi on his own brother...
Nah brother vs brother tends to get pretty violent
TWIN brother-the real fascinating thin is Kishi having a twin brother
I find it fascinating as BROTHERLY rivalry -complement ended as the real theme of the nardoverse before it got corrupted in this spin off,and by Kishis´s own regrets as neglectful father
it´s like a loltastic version of East of Eden the book complete with dad issues,( not the Jimmy Dean movie version)- especially of the unholy Twins-two sides of coin- Cal the dark and Aron the blond
a manga version in which the golden twin..... wins
In Kish´s case I suspect he's the Aron
to chase over a man who tried to kill me twice and marry him
To chase over the karmic brother who tried to kill me 3, 4 times, and after a tender mutual mutilation, offering him my first born to shape him.
Some are still asshurt Sakura got the D
I guess that puts an end to that.
It´s the Abra´s curse
Her role is so thankless it had to be amplified in the movie
No i*c*st on this forum, please!
Besides, Itachi ships Sasunaru
,,I ship you two" -said by Itachi.
And you all act as if Sasuke only beaten Naruto up as if shit like this did't happen
And have some respect for my man Itachi, he tried his best
I mean, Kishimoto also said Naruto and Sasuke's relationship makes them look like psychos, so I don't know why people always bring up Naruto's insistent pursuit of Sasuke to justify Sakura's.
>still thinking their relationship is well written
I don't care that they got together, since I don't care about who either character bones, but let's not act like it was well done or doesn't deserve mockery, like much of Kishimoto's writing.
You all so insecure, damn.
I'm not insecure far from it actually.
I'm more asshurt that sasuke didn't finish the job, i mean suckura was right THERE for godsake, sasuke should've easily killed her but that damn plot armor just had to intervene
Well initially I think it was about persevering even though you're not "special", that you can be great no matter where you came from. That's the vibe that Naruto (the character) gave. Hinata had that too, even though she was looked down upon by her clan she gave Neji a pretty respectable fight. Same with Rock Lee.
It tried to teach that hard work can be just as good as, or overcome natural born talent and with hard work you can be great.
Then Kishi fucked up and made Naruto, from the very beginning, destined to be a savior, the strongest, the best etc. While Rock Lee and Gai embodied Kishis original philosophy they simply weren't relevant, or prominent enough to change that failed tone.
I don't know about that.
Naruto had the Kyuubi from the very start. That by default meant that he would be "SPECIAL". Readers who thought otherwise tend to ignore the role the Kyuubi played in most of his Part 1 fights. (Haku, Oro, Neji, Gaara, etc). Naruto did not counter those peoples special abilities through "Hard Work", he countered them with his own special ability (Kyuubi).
Same thing with Naruto being the Yondaime's son. That was pretty much an accepted theory once people saw the resemblence between the two in Part 1.
The Hard Work theme was more isolated I feel to Rock Lee. People just took it as an overarching manga theme for some reason and applied it to Naruto.
The main problem with the hardworking theme though was that the geniuses of this manga also worked hard. Sasuke's past time was trainning, heck the first thing he demanded of Orochimaru was training in Part 2. Neji re-created Kaiten and 64-Strikes etc. Why should "Hard Work" pay off for the 'talent-less' and not for the 'genius'?
Regarding OP:- In all honesty I don't know what the original themes of this manga were. The only acceptable idea I believe is that of 'Bonds'.
oh hell naw-that's why Nardo got so jealous that he yelled what he yelled-
AND lol-Itachi won the brother competition in the end
and he had the hots for Danzo-poor Zurripanda only happen to be in the middle
To ruin Sasuke
and hey, he did, as a matter of fact as he´s currently out Itaching him-a bravo for the parricidal tool
Nope , mi Hisoka. I´m always deadly sure in my reading book clubs
Precisely because salt mines since november 14
He coudnt even end Karin
that´s why Sakura was there
LOL as if
he was drained and bat blind-it was plot armour that saved him
You are my friend
Nope, it was a curse which pushed him so far down the social ladder that people would rather hang around a leper.
And the Kyuubi also wasn't portrayed as powerful as it was in P2, so even if we go with your assumption, Naruto wouldn't be beyond say a Sannin if we were to continue with P1 portrayal (Since Sannin were portrayed superior to Kurama in P1 imo). Hell Kurama was suggested to just be boss summon+ level.
So no, in P1 he wasn't destined for greatness.
It doesn't matter because the Kyuubi alone at that time wouldn't push him even near Sannin level.
He would've needed to bust his ass to pass that level.
In P2 it's like "oh I learned SM in 2 days, oh I have KCM, oh I have BSM, oh I have RSM" etc. Just spoonfed buffs through the series.
We've never seen Naruto work more hard than when we saw him try to learn to the Rasengan.
Jiraiya - "I haven't seen him in DAYS, he must still be out training" these "days" suggest at least 3 or 4 days, if not more.
We saw Naruto train until his body was collapsed and he literally couldn't move. Tsunade, a world renowned medical shinobi thought Naruto would be in bed for 2-3 days due to the exhaustion (however she did no calculate for the enhanced regeneration that the Kyuubi passively gives Naruto)
So Naruto literally had to exhaust himself to the point where the Kyuubi couldn't regenerate him.
That's serious dedication and hard work, far beyond the scope of ANYTHING we've seen in the manga either before or after that (work wise)
Never has it been said in the manga in P1 that "Oh Naruto looks like Minato, he's destined for greatness for sure"
Because only a few knew that Minato was Naruto's father, it was one of the closely guarded secrets in the manga.
Sasuke never had to practice to even be average.
Learning an entirely new skill that you're terrible at is harder than honing your skills in an art that you're already decent at.
If someone has a different opinion then you they're evil, and you're allowed to beat them into submission.
A curse on his social life?
That might have had an effect on the grown ups but strictly speaking the kids seemed to mostly fine with Naruto and generally thought of him a dunce who disrupted classes by playing pranks all the time which was why they avoided him generally.
For an example Sakura did not hate Naruto because he was the Kyuubi jinchuuriki, she hated him because he was the class clown who kept bothering her.
Your saying the Kyuubi was not portrayed as powerful as it was in Part 2?
That was not the Kyuubi being weak, that was the Naruto not drawing all it's power (and not being able to handle all that power to be honest).
When the Kyuubi was described in Part 1, it was described as :
"A Nine tailed demon fox, one swing of it's mighty tail could crumble mountains and cause tsunamis"
That was the Nine Tails full power. Once Naruto goto to grips with that power he would naturally be able to do the same.
And you think that Naruto was not destined for greatness with that power? That he would not utterly surpass the Sannin?
Naruto using even a tiny fraction of the Kyuubi's power was able to defeat Haku utterly whom he had no chance against before, was able to stand against Orochimaru in FoD, was able to summon a Boss Toad, was able to defeat Neji and take on Gaara...
All that while not manifesting any 'tails' at all. When he did manifest ONE TAIL he took a 3T Sasuke who was using the CS.
Seriously did you read part one ? Kyuubi was treated as monsterously powerful. The mere hint of it manifesting made Kakashi crap his pants during the land of waves arc.
Where did you get the idea that Kyuubi would be just a boss summon level?
I don't know how long it took to learn SM but I bet it was more then two days. Regarding KCM etc. You are forgetting that Naruto already had the biggest chakra battery in his belly since the start of the Manga. All he needed was the proper training to be able to use that chakra battery properly.
Once he got that from Killer B all that power was his to use.
In all honesty I don't know the point you are trying to make in the above paragraph. All it seems to prove is that Naruto was 'Special' from the very start. We may not have known how special exactly but he was special.
Even the Rasengan trainning as you yourself described was something he was only able to do because the Kyuubi was regeneratinng his chakra/stamina. Normal gennin trying to do it would run out of chakra and would injure themselves but Naruto had a Kyuubi battery with healed him.
Note: I am not saying that Naruto would be incapable of the Rasengan by himself but it would have taken him longer to learn as he would not able to train as intensely.
Yet the fact of the matter was that Naruto was the descendant of a legendary ninja and would likley have inherited some measure of the guy's talent.
Wasn't this the complaint you were making ? That Naruto was not the every guy looser with no special heritage who would climb up due to his hard work? Yet in Part 1 it was an accepted fact among the fans that Naruto was the Fourth Hokage's child.
Shuriken Throwing ? Which he had to master himself?
Fire Element? When he got a very basic lesson and then had to learn himself?
Learnt Lightning Element? Then Chidori and trained in speed which Sharingan could not copy?
Learnt Sharingan Genjutsu which Orochimaru could not train him in?
To put it simply you are under-estimating the work the "genius" characters do in this manga because the manga is focused on Naruto's training.
Platero´s logic at its finest
IF and providing you´re the Messiah
Revenge is bad except when you´re a Nara
Sasuke´s favourite hobby is training
im viewer no# 1,000 of this post