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Why can't Hollywood make a decent Superhero movie?

Discussion in 'Konoha Theatre' started by mpthread, Jan 16, 2005.

  1. mpthread

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    So why can't Hollywood make decent super hero movies? They used to be great, the first two batman's where excellent and even some of the Superman movies where good, it's been a while but I remember nothing to bad about the movie based on the Flash. So where did Hollywood go wrong, maybe it was after batman three. Every superhero that I have seen recently is just plain bad starting from when the first X-men movie came out. Spider man 1 and 2 where alright but they still where not that good. The hulk was very horrible and the Elektra movie just plain pissed me off. I'll most likely see the Fantastic 4 movie and the Batman Begins movie just cause I'm a fan of comic books. So back to the main point, there are so many stories out there for the movie people to pick from and they always seem to ignore them and create there own craptacular scripts full of horrid lines. The actors are really no better and just don?t seem do well as the character. The directors do horrible things and they always have to change the costumes to something not as cool. So enough ranting, any opinions out there?
     
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  2. Blue Supporting Staff Retired Staff

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    I'll comment on some Superhero movies:

    Spiderman: This was an awesome movie. I dunno what you're talking about. And Kirsten Dunst is my identical twin.
    Spiderman 2: Not as good as the first but still 8/10
    Daredevil: WTF OMG WTF 0/10
    Hulk: blek...2/10
    Punisher: Not too bad. 7/10
    Catwoman: OMFG WTF :mad
    The Batmen: not bad...average 6/10 original 8/10

    So it's a balance between good and bad...but the bad ones are BAD. Really REALLY bad. The good ones don't make up for it.
     
  3. Lacus Clyne

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    I don't think it is that all superhero movies nowadays are bad, but the ones that are not very good (i.e. Catwoman) are just so awful that they give a bad reputation to the superhero genre.
     
  4. Jh1stgen

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    Um ... Spiderman 1 was aight but 2? If you didn't follow the original plot (cartoon) ... you would know that SM2 story plot was bs. Spiderman didn't loose his power bc of personal will, it was bc of the spider DNA that is mutating Peter. First transformation was the 4 arms then he turned into a real spider. As well, Spiderman never took of his mask into the public. I could write an essay but I'm too lazy
     
  5. Lee Rock

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    Spiderman 1 was IMO better than any of the Batmans, the only comic film that equals it is the 1978 Superman (though X-Men 2 is relatively close). You may not like the second half (which is fine), but the first half was right out of Amazing Fantasy #15 and it was executed perfectly.

    Uh...you can say that the plot of Spidey 2 is unfaithful to the source material, but you can't use the cartoon as the comparison. And I believe the general plot was based off an old issue of Amazing(though I never read the particular ish).

    And the whole losing power thing seemed to be just a metaphor for sexual impotence. Too bad they didn't have any Spide-Viagara.
     
  6. Si Style

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    The Spiderman films were good, I eagerly await the 3rd...just so long as it isn't totally hobgoblin based, cos we've seen that enemies (practically) double in the 1st one. I look forward to seeing the spider mutations and Venom. And what about Blade? A lot of you forget Blade but he is a Stan Lee Creation, also I like the X-men movies.
    Otherwise I don't think the rest are worth mentioning. Comic book movies work like TV and video game movies, with a few exceptions, they're all pretty poor. An example of a good TV movie? South park baby!
     
  7. Fedaykin Fremen

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    yeah well, i know that error in Spidey 2, but it was awesome anyways! But that new Batman movie looks cool!
     
  8. kevin77

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    I guess u gotta put the blame on the directors.

    Batman was great b/c it's Tim Burton who made it. And Timmy is ur goto man when u want a dark movie.

    Spiderman was pretty cool imo. Even Spidey 2 was pretty good; there was some nice romance.

    Also, i believe recent movies don't put the emphasis at the right place. Most of them count too much on SFX and don't really try to write a good script.

    As for Catwoman, I think they just went:"Hey! Halle Berry must look good in leather, let's make a movie about that!"
     
  9. Blitzomaru

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    My review of the recent Comic book movies

    Blade: The first Blade was increible. It set the standard for the series. #2 was good, though they relied too much on special effects. the storyline was very predictable. #3. Ugh. I know these are comic book movies, and they operate in a world where physics does not exist. But if you have some wierd energy crossbow thing in your hand that your claim has quote 'a hundredth the heat and half the brightness of the sun' It would kill you. The movie just seemed to go from one scene to the other with no explainations. Crapfest.

    Catwoman: I will not see this movie, and I love Halle Berry. I just refuse to have the producers of this piece of crap amke money off of me with a purchase or a rental. I wouldn't even download it off of a bittorrent because it might give my computer herpes or something.

    Daredevil: Worse tahn blade 3. Hollywood managed to take a comic character no one likes and make a movie that no one will see.

    Hellboy: Was pretty good, until the end. Don't want to spoil the movie for those who haven't seen it but this is my only gripe about it: The battle betwwen Red and that creature that splits in half every time it's killed took at least 10 minutes. And he only beat it by electricuting it to death. So how does he plow through dozens of them later on? Also, the end fight was too anticlimactic. He gets swallowed and sets off some bombs inside of it. Woohoo.

    Hulk: Ang Lee made a fantastic movie about Bruce Banner. Now if he'd only have read the title of his movie, he'd have been in business.

    Punisher: too stupid for words. i loved the action, but the movie pisses me off for so many reasons that I won't go into it. if I did, this post would be 3 times as long.

    Spider-Man:#1. Fantastic movie. No complaints, though for some reason I know it could have been even better. #2. This is a spider-man story. This movie was written for the fans at heart. The people who complain that there was not enough action can be quiet for all I care. Spider-man isshown as a normal human being, doing the stuff we've all ahd to do. Although they did lay it on pretty thick, they showed what the lowest part of his life was. And at the end they showed what the best part of his life was. My only problems with the movie were these 2. First, everyone finds out he's spider-man in this movie. and 2: if anyone's read the first fight between spider-man and Dock Ock, they know spidey got his ass handed to him. but they also know how spidey finally beat doc ock. with a friign punch to the face! green Goblin can go toe to toe with Spidey. Doc Ock is still human. His tentacles make getting close to him very difficult, but one good punch has always been enough to end the fight.

    X-Men: the first movie did little more than set the characters up. It was more of a drama than an action movie. Though I liked it, it wasn't what an X_men movie should've been. #2: holy hell! The franchise did a complete 180. This movie far surpassed it's predecessor. The only problem i had was that while I am a huge wolverine fan, too much time was spent on him and not other characters. I forgot Cyclops was even in the movie until near the end.

    Louie Punch!
     
  10. kane_x

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    People, people... You're forgeting the key essence of superheroes.... The reason why most superhero movies suck is simple: Lack of Spandex!
    You can't possibly enjoy any superhero movie fully if they are not in fact, in flashy, bright colored spandex, shouting corny lines, like "Halt, you diabolical fiend!". Just think about the legendary Batman TV show. :p

    Only exception to this are Wolverine, Blade and Batman.
    Batman and Blade don't wear spandex, they wear leather/rubber. (Remember the first Batman? The suit was like rubber.) What comes to Wolverine, well, he's just 10x cooler when he's not wearing his costume.
     
  11. Spidey

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    just to add my two cents, i loved the two spider-man movies. I love the fact that they are more than just mindless action movies. I did like the 2nd more than the first though. really looking forward to fantastic four and batman, and of course, spider-man 3
     
  12. Blitzomaru

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    Holy hell. I just saw the trailerr for the F4 movie. Hey Dr. Doom, the comic book golden age called, they want their costume back. Everyone looks cool, though the thing's a bit smaller than I expected, but Doom's costume looks straight out of the old comic books. It's just too plain. And Sin Cinty looks awesome!
     
  13. Mazrim

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    I find the major problem is casting/directors. You have to find actors who actually can pull off the role they are intending. Directors need to find the balance between their own creativity about the movie and sticking to the comic.

    Batman,Batman returns and superman are easily my favourite comic movies. The casting was fantastic for all of those and the directors knew exactly what they intended to do without screwing it up.

    Spider-man 1: Did a great job too. Although, I miss the webs from spider-man's webshooters. Call me a purist.

    Spider-Man 2: Not as good as the first but the action was a lot better. They did get doc oc's character down though. Those arms kick ass.

    X-men/X-men2: Entertaining and good but not amazing. They did have some good cast choices though.
     
  14. xenex

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    I'm not a big spiderman fan (from any medium) so I won't comment on it. And as for the batman movies, my whole deal was why the main lead kept changing. It messed with my head so I just stopped caring for super hero movies altogether.

    Then the X-men movies. I was a fan of the comic and TV cartoon and since the movie didn't entirely blow my faith was somewhat redeemed in comic movies. Though I really feel they could have chosen a better rogue.
     
  15. killerklown

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    let me think

    the crow- without a doubt one of the best comic made movie ever. the reason i say this is because it had everything right, from the scenery to the acting. nothing can beat it.

    the punisher- SUCKED. i am talking about the one with Dolph playing Castle. no matter what movie he is in it most likely sucked, except in Rocky because he only said one line and got his ass kicked.

    the punisher(remake)-better than the first and most other comic hero movies out there. it had decent acting, not great, but decent. also the story line was way way better than the first.

    batman- any batman movie with Adam West and Burt Ward will always be great.

    batman 1 & 2- great movies, why? Tim Burton. he can capture the true essence of any dark, brooding superhero. not only that but it stuck to the original batman. dark and pissed off.

    batman(others)- Sucked. the started off good but it was to bright and cheery and their chose of actors wasnt the greatest i mean come on Arnold he doesnt fit the role people.

    spiderman 1 & 2- they were good. nothing too great nothing too bad. the only thing that makes these movies good are Sam Raimi and Bruce Campbell. without them it would mostlikely suck.

    League of Extrodinary Gentlemen- Was a good movie. the acting was great and so were the chose of actors and the story line went perfectly. nothing really to discuss here.

    blade- it was a great movie. from the story to the acting to even the action tis movie was great. no compliants

    blade 2- not as good as the first. it really went down hill. i found myself focing me to watch it at itmes cause i couldnt pay attention to it. but its not as bad as the punisher with Dolph.

    blade 3- didnt want to watch it

    elektra- read above comment

    daredevil- the only thing i liked about this movie is that it didnt have a happy ending.

    catwomen- rip off of the crow. "hey lets take a women and say that cats carry the soul of the person when they die and she wants to get revenge on the people that killed her." wow sounds almost like the crow but this movie sucked. worst comic made movie yet.

    X-men1 & 2- so far there seems to be nothing wrong with the x-men movies. they have good story lines and can keep you interested till the end, but you can only watch them if your in the mood. and if what i hear is right,Halle Berry not being in the 3rd one, then things look good.

    Hulk- Sucked. it was too long. didnt star Lou Ferigno and it took him close to 45 minutes to become the Hulk. the action scenes are the only thing that saved it from being the worst one yet oh and the fact that catwomen came out.

    Fantastic 4- my opinion is that it wont be that great. i mean the thing looks like a walking scab. but you never know it might be good.

    and there yo have it people a list of some comic made movies and what made them great(the crow) to what made them suck(catwomen). i hoped you enjoyed reading this and any questions just leave a post or contact me.
     
  16. nigggs

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    blade, spiderman, and the batman franchises is pretty good.

    however daredevil, electra, and hulk were pretty dissapointing.

    lets hope fantasitc four will one of 2004's best movie of the year. :leepose
     
  17. SStrunks

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    speaking of superhero movies fantastic 4 doesnt look so bad....atleast thats what I think after watching the trailer below...Well when the real movie comes out we'll see if it continues the horrible superhero movie thing....

    narutoppc
     
  18. Mariwara no Kami

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    The reason that Stan Lee put the webshooters in the original comic strip was to pull the reader into the suspense of having time to reload and not be attack the next week. It was Stan's decision to give him the "natural" webshooters. So I wouldn't call you a "purist".

    Now out of the superhero movies I've watch I have like or loved these

    X-Men 1&2
    Spiderman 1&2
    The Hulk
    Blade
    Superman 1
    Batman 1&2
    and thats about it.
     
  19. mrberns

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    I will agree that just a bout every super hero movie with the exception of the original batman has been either below par for either the film industry or the comic book industry. Its always either untrue to story or poorlly made. Luckilly both the new Batman, and the new Fantastic four look to be very good, and i'm hoping that they break the cycle of both being great adaptations of a comic, and great films.
     
  20. Mazrim

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    No kidding? I didn't know that. Nice.
     
  21. trev

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    Constantine, despite a few changes to the character, looks to be a good film, and true to the book. Once people get over the fact that Keanu is playing John instead of someone more suitable (I think Moore said the character designs were based on Sting) that all of the other mannerisms are there (chain-smoker, cynical, sardonic, and being an all around smartass). I?m just not sure how the general public will respond to it, as its pretty much a cult book now. Some friends of mine really liked the test screening they went to, but they never read the comic beforehand. I was impressed with what they showed me at Comic-con last year, and they?ve had plenty of time to improve upon it.
     
  22. Shadow Replication 1480

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    For some reason, I think I may be the only person alive that didn't hate Dolph as Punisher. IMO, the only things that made the first movie suck was the really weak plot(it's like the story was just lame filler inbetween sagas) and low budget the film had. Of course, I didn't like how they screwed up Castle's history, either(in both movies), but hey, can't always get what you want, eh?
     
  23. killerklown

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    Dolph sucks, but who cares. i dont mind people saying that they thought the first Batman was great, because i agree too, but what abot The Crow. What am i the only person that thought that that was one of, if not the, best comic made movie ever?
     
  24. Squirrel King

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    I actually think Fantasitc Four looks good.. heh. But I also thought Daredevil was going to be good from the previews and that was god-awful.

    I didn't really like the first Spiderman, but I enjoyed the second one.

    The Punisher was alright.. a bit over the top, but it was cool. I saw the old one when I was alot younger, don't remember if it was good or bad.

    The blades were cool.. I don't care what anyone says.

    The Hulk looked so bad I didn't even consider seeing it. The game was fun for about 5 minutes.

    The Xmens rocked.

    Eh what else is there..

    Yea so it seems they CAN make a good movie, don't know what you're talking about. Some are good some are bad. Welcome to the world of movies.
     
  25. IkariBattousai

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    Actually, the Crow was a great comic book movie, but it's one of those comics that people don't realize were based on comics. Like Road to Perdition and From Hell were based on comic books.
     
  26. JustinCredible

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    Batman Three was when it started. Actually thats incorrect, there have always been bad comic book/superhero flicks...

    What? How so?


    Outside of what you listed an aguement can be made for 'The Hulk' which focused more the philosphy behind the Hulk rather then the comic itself. But it the cinematography in that flick is probably the best in a long while. Elecktra was horible because it was a Jennifer Garner vehicle, not a movie based on the character. Everything else there you have I totally disagree with.

    How could the Punisher, I assume you are refering to the 2004 movie not the 1989 flick, could rate higher then Daredevil.. just doesn't make any sense at all.

    Have to stop right there... the original plot ISN'T from the cartoon... totaly disregard the cartoon... the movies are based on the comics.

    No, it was a combination of various factors.

    1) Michelle Pfeiffer was supposed to get a Catwoman movie. But due to Burton leaving the franchise and then Schumacker running into the ground. WB put all Bat-flicks on hold. She got tired of waiting and she moved on never looking back. When the WB was ready to start production on the flick... they had to recast.
    2) Ashley Judd was then asked, but turned it down to do a play. Not able to find someone who fit the Selina Kyle mold that has box office punch... they thought to think outside the box.
    3) Halley Berry, whom was a huge fan of Julie Newmar and Eartha Kitt's presentation of Batman (From the Adam West live action show), she pushed to get the part. So with her optioned, they had to re-write the story as an elseworld type of movie.

    The writers did a terrible job and thats where the majority of the flick goes wrong... plus Halley is using the 60s Catwoman as the mold for her presentation.

    You had me up until here... What are you talking about? Daredevil isn't a 'hugely popular' character... but to say no one likes is rediculos. When Daredevil got rebooted before the flick it became and has been one of the most popular and well written books on the market. I watched the flick, it was good minus the studio interferance that cut an entire subplot from the flick. Watch the directors cut.

    Right on... but for X2 to mee it did a 180 in the sense of too much action, not enough story.

    Any article saying Stan give the thumbs up? Webshooters were also a key portion of his personality... a representation of his intelligence and was used many times creatively to save the day. Spiderman wins fights with brains 95% of the time.

    Anyways other great Comic Book flicks people have forgotten to mention:

    Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
    -The cartoon was a far depature from the comic, but the movie combined both extremely well.

    Superman 2
    -One of the few examples of multiple villians working well in one flick. Plus doesn't have that much of an idiotic ending as Superman rewinding the world.

    Superman 3
    -Total 'Action Comics' type of movie. Extremely tongue and cheak, but thats how AC comics were... they did it consistantly, but without being overly cheese-like.

    Batman - Mask of the Phantasm
    The Rocketeer
    Men In Black
    The Mask
    Mystery men


    Ghost World, Road to Perdition and From Hell are Comic Book movies... but they're not Superheroes.


    And want to talk about bad flicks?
    Batman & Robin, Spawn, Super Girl, Superman IV, The Punisher(s), Elektra, Fantastic Four (94), Swamp Thing, Howard The Duck (I still like it, but it is bad), Captain America (both flicks), Judge Dredd (once again, I liked it... but it is bad), Barb Wire, Steel, Blade 3, League of Extraordinary Gentlemen.


    When you look at the bigger picture, the ratio of good superhero flicks to bad is pretty decent in comparison the ratio of good to bad in all other genres. Just think about it.
     
  27. HumanWine

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  28. less

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    Batman 1 was awesome, Hellboy was awesome (yes it was, screw you :mad), V For Vendetta was enjoyable despite flipping off much of the source material and if the blog and on-set photos are anything to go by, Watchmen might turn out a hell of a lot better than anyone had dared hope for.

    Thus, the question in the thread title is based on false premises, namely the assumption that Hollywood can't make a decent superhero movie, and any answer given would be meaningless.
     
  29. Vonocourt

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    You bring back a topic from two-years ago...and then don't even bother to contribute to it.:notrust
     
  30. Sunuvmann

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    Spiderman 1 & 2 were win. 3 sucked. I enjoyed Superman Returns and Batman Begins. Admittedly, both needed more ass kicking. Especially Superman.

    All 3 X-Men I enjoyed when first watching it...though in retrospect...they weren't that good <_<

    When I was a little kid, the old Batman movies were awesome. But looking back on it, they were utter shit. I truly dislike the style and I really enjoy how they are going for the realism in The Dark Knight and did in Batman Begins.

    Fantastic Four, it was fun to watch but not that good of a movie. Especially the second >.>

    Daredevil was pretty good. It was a tad over the top with the drama but I enjoyed watching it and especially the effects of him being able to see the sound.

    League of Extraordinary Gentleman was an amazing movie. No complaints.

    Thats about it for the ones I saw >.>


    The thing that makes a good Superhero movie for me is the whole plausibility factor. Either you are lol.fuck science, and roll with that, or you make the audience (read: me) think, HEY! THAT COULD WORK LOL! If a movie tries to go half assed and bridge both sides, it will more than likely fail miserably.

    But when it comes to movies, Hollywood generally doesn't try very hard with any of the non major titles because they figure, hell people are going to go to it anyway, why should we bother. With the big titles, they actually try harder as they know that although only a small sect of the population are avid comic book readers, EVERYONE knows Superman and Spiderman. Because of that name recognition, they want to not make it shit since they want to get laymen into the seats.
     
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